How do you rate the trainer Don Turner?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by reznick, Dec 15, 2017.


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  1. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Please show which of my accusations are false, not that I have accused anyone of anything!
    Impure agenda based questions? Which ones would they be, give us examples?
    Why would I have an agenda against Mr Turner I don't know him!

    Your opinion of me? Sonny I couldn't give a flying f*ck what some, wet behind the ears, tearful teenager thinks of me.
    Now, why don't you grow a pair and do some research to find the truth , then engage on your own thread by replying to the questions I've posed?
    If you do come up with primary sourced proof I will be the first to congratulate you for educating us both.Just don't expect me to accept at face value every piece of," old flannel ,"that is presented here because I am bullsh*t proof!
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2017
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    #76
  2. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    You don’t know any context of the photo of Goldman using the pads.

    He could’ve been demoing some new product. He could’ve been trying something new out, and later decided it wasn’t worth his time.

    You are looking at one photo of him using he pads, and are making the assumption that he duly endorsed the practice. We don’t know if he did or didn’t.

    And again, even if he did endorse them, it doesn’t mean that Turner can’t develop his own views.

    Now you’re insulting me again, calling me emotional and whining? I’m only bringing you up because you accused me of making this thread as an attack on you.

    So you’ve come up with this delusion that this thread was made for you, you’ve attacked me for it. And by telling you that you’re wrong (and a bit crazy) I’m emotional? Lol.

    Is there boxing history forum out there with this level of engagement and depth, that isn’t run by some psychotic angry grandpa?
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2017
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    #77
  3. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    You accused me of making this thread as an attack on you. Yes or no?

    Don’t expect anyone to do research for you when you’re being insufferable. Ever heard of a word called cooperation?

    I can’t post something I read on Boxrec without being demanded of to produce proof?

    @McGrain or other mods, is this the experience I should expect here? Please tell me, because if this is normal, I’m out, and we can save us all the time, the headache, and the back channel whispering.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2017
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    #78
  4. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Where did I say it was an attack?
    You accuse me of trying to shut down conversation about Turner,yet I am the only one discussing and asking questions about him! Do you see anyone else doing it?
    I've posted 24 times on this thread and put up numerous clips yet I'm trying to close the subject down?
    Your argument is absurd.As are you.
     
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    #79
  5. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    “You made this thread and I've replied to it because we both know it was principally aimed at me“

    Aimed at, attacked, now you want to mince words?

    You’ve constrained the conversation so that any post that doesn’t answer your pointed questions are “avoiding.” You’ve conflated the thread with accusations of Turners credibility and aptitude, when clearly a man of his qualifications is already credible and apt, unless overwhelming evidence shows otherwise. This gives us less to no room to talk about him as as a trainer. To sum up the good and the bad and talk about where he ranks in a sensible way. Now this thread has become “prove that Turner hasn’t lied about X, or you will be judged negatively.”


    I will bite, okay? I will freaking bite.
    If Turner was lying about training the Klitschkos, you don’t think the prevalent guys he’s worked with worked (Kovalev, etc) would’ve discovered that through cross referencing? You don’t think his career would be severely harmed by fabricating himself the status of trainer of two of the best Heavyweights in the 21st century? You don’t think he’d be black balled by the community and the sport for such extravagant lies? And you don’t think this would’ve occurred by now with the content being out there on YouTube?

    Now what is more likely, that he made up having trained the Klitschkos, or rather that he actually did at some point?

    If you want to learn, explore, and discover more about this through research, I’m happy to do so. But I’m not going to do out of some malicious pressure. I like to learn about boxing because it’s fun, and I have fun doing it. And doing it this way is not fun, and skews the process.

    Anyhow, I think he’s a pretty decent trainer. He seems to have vast experience training with the greats. He seems to be like a less accomplished version of Arcel. A guy who is active in many training camps, and who trains many different fighters for short periods of time. Not quite sure how or where I’d rank him. I was hoping for some good posts to help me get a better context for it. Alas..
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2017
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    #80
  6. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Nope I read the text that accompanied it , it said Goldman was the innovator who made the pads popular.
    So you are wrong yet again! I thought you said you posted this earlier? Pity you didn't read the text with it!
    I haven't said the thread is an attack on me. If it was it would be counted a dismal failure!
    WTF don't you do some research?
    Why isn't Turner credited for training the Klits? Pryor,McCallum,Lomachenko? Why would that be?
    The only person crediting him with training them is himself, and now you.
    He was only the trainer for Kovalev for his first18months in the US and his first 10 fights.
    How do I know this? Because unlike you, I did some research!
    He was the "assistant trainer of the second Kovalev v Ward fight.
    Now I'll tell you why you are championing MrTurner.
    Because he said,Rocky Marciano was the hardest puncher I ever seen".
    Since he was 15 years old when Rocky had his last fight I have to wonder if he actually saw him fight in the flesh when he was still living in Cincinnati, over 600 miles from NY where Marciano fought Moore!

    Its entirely possible imo that his opinion was formed from what you recently called old blurry jumpy films of varying quality,when they applied to my watching footage!
    I'd bet my house that if Turner had stated that," Rocky Marciano was the most overated puncher I ever seen" You would have said he was an old bullsh*tter!

    ps I don't run this forum and I have zero influence here, nor would I want any, and the only Mod I have ever communicated with is McGrain,I don't even know who the others are!
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2017
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    #81
  7. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    I think Don Turner is a great trainer. Everything he says stands up. I have watched some of the YouTube videos and he isn’t saying anything outlandish. If it goes against newer views then he is well placed to say his piece.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2017
    choklab, Dec 19, 2017
    choklab, Dec 19, 2017
    #82
  8. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    If Turner said that “Rocky Marciano was the most overated puncher I ever seen" he would be entitled to his opinion but I personally would disagree. I have no truck in disagreeing with all time trainers. But usually they are in line with me.
     
    choklab, Dec 19, 2017
    choklab, Dec 19, 2017
    #83
  9. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Well Chok you are as entitled to your opinion as the next man.

    For the record may I please ask you these questions?
    Do you believe:
    Andre Ward is an ordinary fighter.
    Salvador Sanchez was an ordinary fighter.
    Miguel Antonio Barrera was an ordinary fighter.
    Pad work is bullsh*t.
    The shoulder roll is bullsh*t.
    Rocky Marciano would have ko'd Wladimir Klitschko with the first punch he connected with.
    Floyd Mayweather Jnr would have been just a 6 round preliminary fighter in the 50's.
     
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    #84
  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    The comment was not directed at you.
     
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    #85
  11. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    :biggrin:
     
    mrkoolkevin, Dec 19, 2017
    mrkoolkevin, Dec 19, 2017
    #86
  12. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    What kind of "good posts" were you looking for? Little known facts? Testimonials from former fighters and other trainers? Are you only interested in those that sing his praises?
     
    mrkoolkevin, Dec 19, 2017
    mrkoolkevin, Dec 19, 2017
    #87
  13. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    There was no text with the photo I posted.
    More insults and non sequiter.
     
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    #88
  14. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    There was with the pic I added, unfortunately I cant find it at the mo.How would I know Goldman was credited with being the innovator who made the pads popular otherwise? You can call me names but I musn't respond?Yeah right! Goldman used the pads with Rocky to improve his timing and accuracy its in the book," The Arc Of Boxing".The trainer who really made pad work the norm was Emmanuel Steward.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2017
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    mcvey, Dec 19, 2017
    #89
  15. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    How he got started training fighters.
    Why he gets hired by great fighters often.
    What his roles were in their training camps.
    How they personally valued his participation in the camps.
    etc.

    Putting him on the stand, and scrutinizing every embellishment he has, and casting doubt over his overall credibility, is not what I consider high quality, good, nor informative posts.

    Guys like Kovalev and Holmes hired him.
    Their hiring him speaks volumes more than some unfounded and/or non essential critiques that happen to align with obvious agendas.
     
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    reznick, Dec 19, 2017
    #90
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