False Panics! - Fights that are perceived to be close, but really weren't

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Russell, Jan 5, 2018.


  1. Russell

    Russell Loyal Member Full Member

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    Idea stems from two separate places. One is a recent thread about the Ken Norton vs Larry Holmes bout and how it wasn't as close as many would lead you to believe. Perception vs reality and all that. I don't really have an opinion on the bout, I haven't watched the fight for something like 10 years.

    The second is the Moorer vs Botha match-up, which I just watched today. The "online voters" had the bout narrowing as the fight progressed, and while I do agree that Botha improves on nearly being stopped in the third round, he's never in control of the fight. He throws a lot of right hands, and most of them appear to be caught on Moorer's gloves. Meanwhile Moorer lands a consistent, ram rod jab to the face the entire night and quite frankly, Botha takes a pretty violent beating. He's cut above his right eye in the third but bleeding never became an issue.

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    This was after the Foreman fight, so I'm not sure why the expectations were so sky high on Moorer. You would have imagine they would have leveled out a bit by this time. He doesn't look bad. I don't think so anyway. One judge actually had this a one point fight. Thankfully, the other two had it more accurately scored.

    What would you picks be? A fight that you heard was close for years, but upon close inspection, it really wasn't so much the case?
     
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  2. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    I definitely remember being surprised when I watched Holmes v Norton as I thought Holmes was comfortably ahead going into the last round. How the judges made it so close was baffling.

    The reverse case for me was Chavez v Taylor where I thought the fight was much closer than I'd been led to believe. I still thought Taylor was ahead but there were some very close rounds and Chavez was definitely landing the more telling punches. Taylor's combinations were flashy so they were more eye catching but Chavez's were more damaging as proved to be the case. Harold Lederman's scorecard was almost ridiculously one-sided as he had it a virtual shut out for Taylor after 11 rounds.
     
  3. Longhhorn71

    Longhhorn71 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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  4. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Marcel vs Gomez (first fight) and Shibata. He really handled them both but got a robbery draw against Shibata and was only awarded a majority decision against Gomez I believe. I didn't think the Arguello fight was as close as some do either; Marcel really rallied down the stretch in that one and beat Alexis at his own game despite looking to have been tiring in the middle rounds.
     
  5. Sting like a bean

    Sting like a bean Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    Yeah I agree completely on Chavez vs Taylor. (Incidentally, that's the very first fight I ever intently watched all the way through, as a little kid.)

    I was always baffled by the people outraged at the stoppage, as it requires them to employ an explicit double standard for when technicalities should or shouldn't matter:

    "Hey, Taylor was technically ahead on points, so clearly any reasonable person has to disregard that there was technically two seconds on the clock."

    Supposedly Steele was therefore obligated (ethically?) to overlook the obvious fact that Taylor was technically unfit to continue. It never ceases to amaze me how people will insist on splitting only the hair that suits them.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2018
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  6. Grapefruit

    Grapefruit Active Member Full Member

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    Mayweather McGregor was a perfect example of this, McGregor had no chance and was played with and walked down
     
  7. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    I didn't think Lomachenko-Russell was close at all, the cards were a bit baffling in that one.
     
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  8. Longhhorn71

    Longhhorn71 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The referee's prime responsibility is to protect the fighter(s).
     
  9. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Hagler-Duran. Nunn-Barkley? I completely agree re: Holmes-Norton.
     
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  10. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    How did you score it? Pretty sure I had Taylor winning the first 8 rounds.

    Biggest reverse case for me was Duran-Leonard I, a very close fight.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2018
  11. The Funny Man 7

    The Funny Man 7 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Erik Morales vs In Jin Chi. Plenty of people scored it a draw or a win for Chi some even saying it was a robbery. It was a close fight but I thought that Morales' tactical superiority allowed him to net enough closely fought round to clearly win.

    I think people's opinions were shaped by the fact that Morales looked burnt out/jaded for the second fight in a row and that he was struggling with a lightly regarded opponent. Of course Chi would later prove he had world class ability, even though he never accomplished as much as his formidable abilities could have managed.
     
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  12. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    I watched it again the other day and although I didn't actively score it, I did think Taylor was well ahead in the first half of the fight but as the fight moved into the second half, my impression was that Chavez was landing more frequently than in the previous rounds and with harder punches than Taylor. By the ninth Taylor's blows just weren't popping as much. I think some of those rounds were in the balance and could have been awarded to Chavez. By the 10th, Chavez was definitely edging the rounds and the 12th was a two point round had there been no stoppage.

    My point is that not giving Chavez a single round going into the final round almost shows a willful ignorance to what Chavez was achieving in there - a gradual accumulation of punishing punching (as was his style). Richard Steele himself said that he could tell that Chavez's punches were having a damaging effect even quite early in the fight. Of course, if it were the 15 round era, there'd have been no controversy because there would have been no way Taylor would have made it to the final bell, even without the stoppage in the 12th.

    I thought the judging was actually close to perfect on Duran-Leonard. Two scored it by one point to Duran and one by two points so it was a very close fight as reflected in the scoring but the right outcome.
     
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  13. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

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    Duran/Leonard 1 in Montreal. I would also say that Duran/Hagler wasn't as close as the judges had it. I thought Marvin won by a few rounds.
     
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  14. BCS8

    BCS8 VIP Member

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    McGregor took arguably 4 rounds off Floyd before he gassed and the supposed ATG took over. Floyd looked terrible and embarrassed the sport of boxing.
     
  15. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    A lot of people thought Barrera-Marquez was close. As a MAB fan, I didn't think it was close at all. MAB fought competitively throughout, but was clearly losing round after round after round. He no longer had that extra dimension that previously made him so tremendous.
     
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