How do you guys measure power when comparing different fighters?

Have you done any actual comparisons on this against other great punchers?
Have you compared it to all the fights that Louis, Dempsey, Foreman, and Liston had that went that many rounds against comparable opponents?

The honest answer you seek if right here: Even if you are the hardest hitter in boxing, and even one of the best punchers in boxing, it doesn't mean you can bulldoze and slug through high level opponents in 2 rounds like some comic book. Maybe going for broke in the first three rounds made him feel open to defeat? Your expectation isn't met with what happens in reality. It's like criticizing some great home run hitter for not achieving some never before attained home run numbers. Or like saying that one of the jazz legends wasn't good enough.

Doesn't Rocky have one of, if not the best KO % of all the elite punchers?
You're snorkeling for flaws in a sea of great achievement. The inaccuracy and imbalance in your intention is not sufficient in describing Marciano. Your points of contention are unmerited from what I can tell. And you're deducting points from him by comparing him to this completely abstracted idea of what a supreme puncher should be.

 

I think the thing with Marciano being called a grinder is that he simply wasn't that accurate. Punch placement and timing are every bit as important as raw power. He threw every shot with bad intentions, but most of his punches weren't really clean hits. He showed against Walcott and Layne what he could do when he landed clean, and it wasn't pretty.

 

Marciano hit like a *******.......but he often just glanced his opponents or barely reached them to the head because of his very short arms...and Moore was cutey for sure

 

When I watch a fighter I look for the effects of his power.....not the single KO so much as the impact and response from the opponent......for example Joe Smith is a raw puncher with less than average skill but everything he lands appears to hurt and the opponents get more cautious which speaks volumes to how dangerous his power is......Tong Ayala Jr, Duran, Jackson, Trinidad, Hagler, Tyson, Foreman, and select fighters could change the nature of a fight and the opponents plan with jabs and glancing blows....old Foreman was a great example the look in the faces of his opponents after a jab or near miss was enough to tell me how powerful he was....Tyson had similar reactions to his power but not like Foreman did.

A guys record does not tell the whole story his power can force safety first survival tactics....if he lacks the skills to cut the ring off he better make the first connect end it otherwise he is another Graziano looking like a caveman trying to land his right.....Marciano had power his opponents deteriorated trying to fight him and changed tactics if they had anything left....Double cross or not Johnson's response to Ketchel said he was not going to chance it anymore too dangerous.....Listons response to Williams told me Williams was hurting Sonny and Sonny decided he would rather try and KO him than take those punches for 10 rds.....

That's how I gauge powers measures of effectiveness

 

Not to be nasty but if all those guys said Foreman hit harder than Shavers you would be lapping it up. The testimony for Shavers is basically unaminous and certainly awe inspiring. The guy could whack, no if's or but's.

 

I think that's part of it. To me it feels that he gave up some technical aspects of the game in lieu of being able to hit very hard and hitting often. When you wind up for punches the other guy has a small window of time to adjust to the incoming, and that makes a difference to one's punch resistance.

Some would argue that his technique was bad overall, but I don't think that's true. His defence towards the end was actually pretty good and he wasn't nearly as easy to land on as has been said. He did what he could with what he had.

 

Those three had some of the best "mule kick" mechanics. Baer and Foreman relied on them the most, and were probably some of the naturally hardest hitters ever.

Shavers is a bit more of a mystery to me mechanically. He tired from his punches fast, but had insane power in them. My theory is he had the frame to handle more exertion which came at the expense of stamina.

Some top punchers who are mule kick punchers in the purest form:

Louis
Baer
Foreman
Jackson
W Klitschko
Tyson
Steele
Dempsey
Marciano
Lewis
McClellan

Today:
Golovkin
Wilder
Gassiev
Joshua

 

His accuracy certainly wasn't very good,but his asset was,because of his condition, he could throw with his maximum power all night . He took Walcott and Layne out after several rounds of attrition.Walcott had begun to retreat to the ropes, as older fighters do leaning on them to gain a momentary respite,it was a tremendous shot that got him out of there but the groundwork had been done earlier.
He targeted Layne's soft midsection to slow him to a walk and in fights like with Lastarza he had a static target on the ropes yet needed to land countless punches before the fight was stopped with Rollie on his feet. Louis or Dempsey would have ended that fight a hell of a lot quicker. Calling Rocky a grinder isn't derogatory imo that's how Moore refereed to his defeat against him, "being ground down,"

 

Of course that he could bang, but it is like a sect that you have to put shavers the number 1 in the hardest punchers ever.and i disagree.. The facts say a different thing than the words. In fact in the show where ali,tyson and leonard were together ali was asked "do you think that he(mike) could hit harder than earnie shavers? "
Answer of Ali "What? Are you coloured?"
The presenter was obviously a black man.
Yes yes.. Now you will say that ali never fought tyson.. But the fact is that Ali said that he did think that tyson did hit harder than shavers without any doubt .

 

A low ko percentage does not mean a lack of power. Midlands
strongman Tony Sibson had only 31 ko in 55 wins. However Marvin
Hagler stated that Sibson hit him as hard as any boxer he faced.

 

Yeah that’s the Arsenio show.

This is a misreading of context.
They were all being generous and congratulatory about each other. Ali also said of Tyson : “If he hits me once...”

There are times when Ali is saying the right thing, and there are times where Ali is being introspective and analytical. I don’t think it’s too hard to tell the difference.

I’m not saying that Shavers definitely hit harder than Tyson. It is informative, and it does speak volumes about how Ali viewed Tyson’s undeiable power, but it’s not the sort of context you want to hedge everything on.

 

Bingo.