The best fighter in history that Tony Ayala Jr could have beaten?

if you are thinking fab 4? none of them. They were too good. He really never moved up to a high enough level to see how good he was.. Those guys fought the best always..

 

His hype and or respect on here used to be pretty intense... people used to talk about him being one of the potential all time best at 154 if he hadn't completely derailed his own career...

 

Was it just one person? Maybe he posted so much positive stuff fanatically I mistook it for multiple posters being super high on him...

 

Tony Ayala Jr had all the ingredients to be in the mix with any era...hit hard, great boxing skills, killer instinct, mean, fighting instincts beyond his 19 yrs of age for the fights he fought.....he had everything that made Duran great but he had that deviant mentality....the issue is he derailed himself before he got to fight the top guys but make no mistake he was the real deal.....A lot of people seem to dislike him for the criminal he was understandably but he did was a great talent IMO he was the best of the 4 that was making his mark Czyz, Ramos and Moore. I do not like what he did and the person he was but I recognize the potential and skill we lost out on

 

I don't think so either. They were sharp punchers, which is why they were so great.

 

Excellent post

 

it is hard to define Tony.. he really did not fight anyone great, which is too bad we didn't see how good he was. You can sort of tell that he was an offensive guy who didn't have great defense, and against guys like Hearns or Duran or Leonard or Hagler or Benitez, that would have made him open to great punches. If we put him in against the lower level guys? I don't know. I think even the level of Moore would beat him. I mean stepping up in 1983 even to fight a Mark Medal or Carlos Santos level would have been tougher than the guys he fought. He was strong for sure.

 

Ayala is 90% unproven. His two wins of any real significance were Epps and Herrera. Epps was fringe top 10 but lost just prior to fighting Ayala. Herrera was previously top 5 but was ko'd early by a nobody not long before fighting Ayala. He avenged it before fighting Ayala but it dropped him out of the 10 i believe. He beat both extremely impressively.

Ayala had plenty of power particularly in the left hook. Very aggressive, very careless. It was nothing for him to spit on an opponent or try to keep belting people after a fight had been stopped. He was quite hittable and raw but carried that power.

They were trying to get him and Duran together but from memory Ayala signed to fight Moore then was locked up so Duran got the gig. I think Duran would have schooled him and i think Moore would have won a thrilling shootout tho you could argue for both. Moore had proven himself in a string of fights vs world class opponents and he'd be the safer bet.

Ayala may have beaten Kalule at this stage. He wasn't a big hitter and was declining. I couldn't take him against proven established fighters. I think when the level stepped up he wouldn't have stood out.

 

Why would you jump straight to them? I think we should all agree there is plenty of distance between all 4 and Ayala's ceiling (even if you viewed him through rose tinted lenses)

 

this inference was always those 4 because most guys at that time wanted to fight them and he came up when all 4 were huge names. A win over anyone of them meant immediate fame and something they could say for years. Even Kevin Howard just knocking Ray down was memorable. Barkley made a career for saying he beat Hearns. everyone remembers Kirkland Laing beating Duran, but not Benitez-who beat Duran a year later and for Wilfred's title, because Benitez was another legend his win was not seen as too surprising. But Laing was a different story. So I jump to it because Ayala would have fought one or two of them had he not gone to prison.. Hearns vs. Ayala or Duran vs. Ayala are the two I would love to see. Hagler would have picked him apart easiest with his style. I did say I thought two guys at the time who were just decent contenders. Mark Medal or Carlos Santos would have given Ayala a good fight. The only type of fighters I see Ayala beating are more the types who would brawl with him like maybe Mugabi.. Even Buster Drayton would take care of him. The part about anyone in history? I am not sure how to do that. Since Ayala was a fighter for his times..He was charismatic for sure and he had a little of what Wilder shows now. Bravado, and that helps marketing fighters. One thing about marketing. Mike McCallum was soft spoken and let his great skills do the talking, but that did not get him the big fights. Ayala was popular enough at the time. One fight I think Duran would have loved is Ayala. If Ayala could not hurt Duran (which not many could or did) I think Roberto stops him in about 7 or 8 at 154.

 

I believe this to be a great post, John. Cheers!!