Where do you draw the line at Heavyweight vs Super Heavyweight ?

Marciano is clearly superior to Tua as a fighter. I was just saying height and reach wise they were similar and I really want to hear if he would expect Lewis to just decimate him..

 

And what else has happened in that time? Big men getting better, coincidentally, arrives during the era where PED use becomes more common place in professional sports.

 

Exactly. Very, very few of the best heavyweights were over 220lb. Very few. It’s like three dudes in all of history.

Who knows, with 24 hour weigh in what the record heaviest in the ring “on the night weight” is for cruiserweight these days? I bet it is close to 220lb

 

I don't often post here but its so frustrating to see suposedly informed posters on here writing off great heavyweights simply because they're outweighed. A man over 180lbs has the power to knock out anyone; especially iron chinned, ferocious, non stop punching, phenomenon fighters like Dempsey and Marciano who can take punishment from big heavyweights and give it back twice as hard. Smaller heavyweights have the huge advantage of speed and they can manoeuvre around and get their punches of faster and make big heavyweights look clumsy and rely on one big punch which will not work against the best small heavyweight champions we've had.

 

Some of the hardest punching heavyweights were not the Big guys Earnie Shavers 6'ft 208, Sam Langford 5"7 177lbs, Bob Satterfield 5"10 180lbs, Marciano 5"11 189lbs, Sonny Liston 6 1/2 inch 215, Mike Tyson 5"10 215-220, Joe Frazier 5"11 205

I think the weight training & international boxing has advanced the Superheavyweight division but so far who stands out as a Superheavyweight George Foreman 6"3 220lbs Lennox Lewis 6"5 240, Vlad Klitschko 6"6 244, Vitali Klitschko 6"7 245, Anthony Joshua 6"6 245lbs, Wilder 6"7 215-220lbs, Fury 6"7 250lbs ?

With weight training Im thinking Heavyweights 225lbs or 230 and Superheavyweights from there up. I can already see guys in the cruisers busting at the $eams from a ripped 200lbs to a bulking ripped 22olbs

 

Some might be getting carried away. Larry Holmes weighed 210-215 at his peak and always polls well in dream fights against all the big men named. He would certainly have no trouble competing with these guys. Liston was in the same weight bracket as Holmes and again would sure not be out of his depth. Holyfield was 208-210 against Douglas, Holmes and Foreman and i'm sure he would be competitive too. He was 215 and 217 against Lewis when they actually fought. Shavers was 211 when he almost decapitated Holmes. I'd also not be surprised to see Joe Louis fare well in the mid 200's.

 

I agree with you in traditional circumstances. If we could get Gassiev in 6oz gloves, have his giant opponents train for a 15 round fight rather than 12, without steroids, there would be absolutely no need for a cruiser division at all. Guys his size still would be the dominating sized heavyweight. No population explosion or any other excuse would be needed.

But today we have a dilution of talent with far too many governing bodies, titles and weight categories that it is too difficult for the right kind of heavyweight to come through. Young fans from the internet generation grow up believing this is progress and that the big guys are tops. They cannot realise this new species of giant is an artificial creature of circumstance.

We have giant champions learning on the job. Inexperienced champions in the highest weight class fast tracked through an over diluted system. And they cannot see that this is not progress.

 

Don't agree with either of these statements.

Joshua's best win is against a 41 year old Klitschko, and he could easily have lost that one.

I would make him a slight favourite over Maciano, but to say Rocky has no chance, is, to say the least, a stretch. (No Pun).

AS for Dempsey-Fury, I would make Dempsey the favourite in that bout.
How has Fury shown himself superior to Willard, so far ?

 

Lewis and the Klitschkos are no golden trio. Lewis is the best of them. Let’s not forget Most great fighters were better than Mcall and Rahman. Fury and Joshua are so far no better than Willard.

 

Wilder becomes a Super-heavyweight ?

Is size determined by height in your scheme ?

Is Tommy Hearns bigger than David Tua ?

 

There is nothing to stop either of these men from competing in the actual HW division if they choose to.

 

Actually, Wilder could be in a no mans land under my scheme. He is a heavyweight by weight but has a super heavyweight belt. So maybe he joins whatever class he wants.

 

Let’s hope so. They are heavyweights really.

 

Heavyweight you can weigh whatever. I don't understand what the question is. Drawing lines for what purpose ?

Divisions are already in place. They are kind of arbitrary but accepted to proliferate the sport with contests and championships. Limited weight matches have been around forever. Fans have always been interested in seeing who the best at a certain weight or size is.

Heavyweight is the open division. No lines drawn at heavyweight, traditionally.