Sol Strauss of the 20th Century Sporting Club attempted to line up a November 14, 1947 bout for the title between Joe Louis and Elmer Ray in MSG. What if this fight had come off?
They fought three times in 1949. The first two were in Florida. First one was a six rounder. Louis was ahead. The second one Louis had Ray helpless in round three. it is probably listed as “exhibition 4” because Ray retired at the end of round 3. Joe knocked Ray out in the third fight in Texas.
By 1949 Ray was coming to the end of his career. Still, his first two exhibitions with Louis went the full distance. The Associated Press report doesn't say anything about Ray being "helpless" in the third round of the second bout, it says he was staggered, but recovered after a few seconds. In the third bout, Ray was coming off a ko loss to John Holman just a week before and shouldn't have been in the ring at all. He was booed by the crowd for his feeble performance and quit after three rounds. Afterwards his manager asked the NBA to revoke his licence for his own safety and Ray never boxed again. https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=E7cqAAAAIBAJ&sjid=qGQEAAAAIBAJ&pg=2815,5331142 https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=GbcqAAAAIBAJ&sjid=qGQEAAAAIBAJ&pg=3604,6167472 https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth283617/m1/2/zoom
At this stage of Louis career? I see a lot of punishment being dished out and taken from both men. Ray's confidence and abilities were likely at an all time high being on that fantastic unbeaten run he went in for 3/4 years and was good enough to split a series with Walcott and Charles. Competitive decision or a late stoppage for Louis, just because it's Louis, but this is a really hard one to call. If anyone wants to justify how and why Ray wins this one I'm all ears.
It's really not wisdom to take on Louis in an exhibition if you have designs on actually fighting him, is it? Still, maybe he thought if he did wonderfully well he'd get the big purse. Ray was a very very good heavyweight by my guess.
Any insight of how you think Louis would have done in a rematch against Charles. My thinking was the fact a rematch never took place meant Louis was effectively conceding that he didn't think he could beat him second time round and that the current crop of contenders had caught up with his abilities in the ring, as his had dropped considerably.
Yes I saw a photo of that. The gloves were at least 14oz but there was no headguards or vests. In the photo Joe was cracking Elmer with a full force booming right and Rays gum Sheild was half out of his mouth. It didn’t look like he was taking it easy.
Seems like Louis was best placed in 1950 to name the best contenders because he’d fought all of them during his 80 exhibitions since beating Walcott. Flynn, Layne, Henry, Shepherd, Valdes, Hall, Comiskey, Bivins, Valentino.. Joe shared a ring with just about every capable heavyweight in America between 1948 and 1950.
If it was any other fighter, you just wouldn't worry about a rematch but because it's Louis there's doubt. Being honest, I have't snooped around calls for a rematch that did take place. As you say, the fact that one never took place is taciturn acknowledgement of the fact that a Louis victory was unlikely. After all, Louis was a legend and nobody really wanted Charles as champ.