If GGG won the first fight on the cards would you have wanted to see a rematch?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Sugar 88, Jun 15, 2018.


  1. Stallion

    Stallion Son of Rome Full Member

    5,561
    347
    May 6, 2013
    I believe that in such case Golovkin-Saunders would have been general public priority.
     
    kriszhao likes this.
  2. Sugar 88

    Sugar 88 Woke Moralist-In-Chief

    27,259
    18,341
    Feb 4, 2012
    See this is where I think Canelo fans are suffering from confirmation bias. You're confusing competitive with close. You can be competitive in every round but lose 12-0. Canelo didn't lose as widely as that but to give him any more than 4 means you were looking to give him rounds.
     
    C.J., N17, BCS8 and 1 other person like this.
  3. kirk

    kirk l l l Staff Member

    70,887
    27,319
    Jul 26, 2004
    Taking out a completely overmatched opponent, to hide the signs of a slipping fighter, is one of the oldest tricks in boxing.
     
    Rumsfeld, KO KIDD and Sugar 88 like this.
  4. drenlou

    drenlou VIP Member

    75,136
    39,544
    Jan 22, 2015
    I disagree. Canelo landed the better shots and took GGG out of this monster outlook people like GGG Fans like to think he is. I think you're confusing effective aggression vs ineffective aggression. You can be aggressive but not land much of anything of significance while the other guy is the one with the flashier offence and defence. If you have GGG winning 8 rounds out of the 12 you were looking for rounds to sway his way.
     
    shadow111 and TheyDontBoxNoMore7 like this.
  5. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    22,972
    9,801
    Aug 1, 2012
    You could make the same argument for Golovkin fans and those who scored it in favor of Golovkin. That they were looking to give rounds to Golovkin. Golovkin did not win many rounds clearly due to Canelo slipping most of his shots and landing the harder more impactful punches.

    To put this to the test, I challenge you to cite more than 4 rounds that Golovkin won clearly. Any rounds you list I can point to specific punches that Canelo landed that were reasons to give Canelo the round.

    Golovkin just didn't win that many rounds clearly. Rounds 5 and 7 were probably the closest to that, but even those were relatively close when you split up the rounds in segments. (first 2 minutes of round 5 Canelo was winning, for example) The other rounds GGG supposedly won (4, 8, & 9) you're just giving him rounds for coming forward and throwing more punches. That's you looking to give him rounds, not paying attention to the quality of landed punches but just giving rounds for throwing more punches.

    Any of these rounds could be seen as even rounds. Where as rounds like 2, 3, 10, 11, and 12 Canelo did more to actually win those rounds clearly with sustained ring control (rounds 2 and 3) and barrages of clean punching (rounds 10, 11, and 12). So the same argument you are making towards those who were supposedly looking to give Canelo rounds I can turn back around and make it towards those who gave a lot of rounds to GGG.

    Most of the rounds were close enough to score it for either guy if you were looking to score it for either guy. (for different reasons) However if you appreciate the finer points of boxing (slipping punches, counter punches, making a guy miss, etc) Canelo was more impressive round affer round and thus he arguably won more rounds clearly because he landed more eye catching no-doubt-about-it big punches. Punches like that win fighters close rounds, what made it tough was the argument as to whether he landed enough of them compared to Golovkin's volume of thrown punches, but that comes down to your own calculation, i.e. what you are looking for.
     
    drenlou likes this.
  6. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    22,972
    9,801
    Aug 1, 2012
    That's true, but still, just looking at Golovkin himself, he looked healthier than he looked in his previous fights. (regardless of who was in front of him) Just compare him to how he looked in England before the Brook fight. (many commented how washed out he looked) Watching Golovkin walking to the ring vs Canelo, compare that to how he looked coming into the ring vs Vanes. He looked better vs Vanes. It was an easier opponent for sure, but he still looked better. (not just his performance, or how easily he won, but just himself)
     
  7. OpinionOfACasual

    OpinionOfACasual Boxing Addict banned Full Member

    5,111
    3,981
    May 3, 2017
    Your point about 'timing' and there being evidence in the first fight that Canelo could perform even better against an older GGG isn't a good thing.

    It's not a reason for a rematch to occur....in fact it's a reason a rematch shouldn't.

    Canelo could win a rematch, which he doesn't deserve, and the history books will have him undefeated in 2 fights against GGG....When GGG should be 1-0.
     
  8. escudo

    escudo Boxing Addict Full Member

    4,298
    4,629
    May 13, 2014
    That fight was dope. Serious talent from both guys, and produced some truly amazing moments from both. I thought Canelo edged it. Full article https://imgur.com/gallery/lKcAK

    I'd love to see it because it is the two best middleweights in the world and it was highly competitive.
     
    drenlou likes this.
  9. Sugar 88

    Sugar 88 Woke Moralist-In-Chief

    27,259
    18,341
    Feb 4, 2012
    If I was looking for rounds it wad a style preference over any individual bias. I scored Canelo Lara for Alvarez on the same rationale. How did you score that fight?
     
  10. Sugar 88

    Sugar 88 Woke Moralist-In-Chief

    27,259
    18,341
    Feb 4, 2012
    Whilst I almost admire your attempts and commitment to creating a revisionist pro Canelo narrative i've ridden this merry-go-round before.

    Am I right in assuming you also scored Lara Canelo for Saul?
     
    BCS8 likes this.
  11. iii

    iii Boxing Addict Full Member

    6,832
    4,093
    May 3, 2016
    Is this a euphemism....Ok he's a knobhead..there ...you "Made" me say it lol
     
    BCS8 likes this.
  12. Sugar 88

    Sugar 88 Woke Moralist-In-Chief

    27,259
    18,341
    Feb 4, 2012
    He's suggesting he had egg on his face.
     
  13. Sugar 88

    Sugar 88 Woke Moralist-In-Chief

    27,259
    18,341
    Feb 4, 2012
    Another thing perhaps those who scored for Canelo like @shadow111 could perhaps clear up for me is whether or not they believe the judges genuinely broke the fight down in the same way.

    Do you guys think Byrd really broke it down into segments of rounds and individual punches at the time and you guys seem to suggest that to score it for Canelo is need a a comprehensive tv camera breakdown to see all of the work that Canelo was doing that the majority of fans apparently missed.
     
  14. N17

    N17 Loyal Member Full Member

    36,270
    33,086
    Feb 16, 2013
    Personally I would have wanted to see a rematch even if GGG got the decision on the cards in the first fight.

    I believe both fighters can make it a better fight the second time around, both can improve on their last performances and that makes it a better spectacle.

    Even though I scored it for GGG I haven't and didn't say it was one sided or a beating because it wasn't, Golovkin just won more rounds in my opinion.


    Also, everything that has happened since, the debate about the scoring, the failed drug tests and even things like the accusation of illegal hand wraps have made it a must happen rematch.
     
    Sugar 88 likes this.
  15. BCS8

    BCS8 VIP Member

    60,089
    80,114
    Aug 21, 2012
    That too. I was suggesting that he'd recently hatched ;)
     
    iii and Sugar 88 like this.