Would you consider Ali an embarrassment to boxing after manilla

Genuine question for those who say "yes"......... who was a bigger embarrassment, Ali after Manila or Bowe after winning the title?

 

I think he was as well prepared and did as well as he could against Norton, but just had declined quite a bit by then.

 

What?

Just to educate you. Had Joe Frazier not faced his mandatory contender George Foreman, the WBA threatened to strip Frazier and pit Foreman vs. Bonavena for the vacant title.

Joe Bugner was a top contender from 1973 until 1977 - the same period Foreman was at the top.

Quarry and Shavers were BOTH top contenders in 1973 when they faced each other, and Foreman was already the champ at that time. Shavers became a top contender when he knocked out Ellis in 1973, when Ellis was a top contender. Again, Foreman was already champ. Quarry was rated only behind Ali and Frazier when Foreman was champ, but Foreman fought Roman and Norton instead. Hell, Quarry was still ranked #4 when he lost to Ken Norton in 1975. Shavers, Quarry, Ellis, Bonavena and Bugner were peers of Foreman just like Ron Lyle was. Hell, Lyle fought all of them.

Finally, Shavers-Foreman was first mentioned as early as 1969, after Shavers won the National AAU title and was about to turn pro, and when Foreman had notched his fifth or sixth pro win. But, according to Shavers (in his book Welcome to the Big Time), Shavers declined because Foreman's team wanted Earnie to throw the fight.

They were all peers of George Foreman's. He just never fought them.

 

He should have been an embarrassment to himself at the very least...and if he had any good sense, and he didn't,..he would have retired...called it a day...like after the Bugner fight.

 

Waylon didn't count on anybody remembering that infamous episode.

 

I don't think Ali was an embarrassment after Manila. He didn't fight his best, but the best couldn't beat him even when he barely trained.

In terms of embarrassment, probably Bowe.

 

Just ecucate to educate me? Lol you wrote an irrelevant bible.. WE ARE TALKING ABOUT 1974. Bonavena JUST DIED in 1976 and he lost to lyle in 1974(foreman stopped lyle in 1976), quarry was finished by 1974 onwards, i don't care a crap about as he was ranked by then, norton and frazier stopped him and foreman stopped both them AND EVERYBODY KNOWS THAT QUARRY WAS FINISHED BY 1975. Shavers and bugner simply were not rivals for foreman so what the hell are insinuating? Go to watch tennis. I will not spend more with you

 

Nobody is talking about 1974. I don't know what thread you think you're posting in.

 

I think that you are lost in the conversation

 

I'm lost talking with you. You seem to know nothing about the topic.

 

Go to watch tennis sad guy lol

 

I also think that Berbick went easy on him, although Ali looked much better than his previous fight vs Holmes.

 

Sorry but this is wrong. Ali beat Frazier in Manila in late 75. By 76 he was getting decisions over Young and Norton he didn't deserve. He came into the Young fight 230lbs. Maybe the word embarrassment is too strong but if you can't separate the good Ali did from this period then what's the point?

Ali didn't show a lot of respect to the title by coming in fat and hardly fighting during the fight. Unless it was the Holding Clowning Championship. He did plenty of that.

Anyone who looks at Ali's conduct around the 1st Spinks fight and isn't at least a little disturbed has rose colored glasses on. He came in fat again and basically threw the fight. What else can you call it? He didn't try for 14 rounds. Spinks had 7 pro fights for Christ sake!

I'm an Ali fan he was the best heavyweight I ever saw. He did all of of good for the sport he also disgraced the title during this period.

All you Ali fans can flame and bleed on me. I call it how I see it. I dont worship the man.