How mobbed up was Ray Robinson?

He lost a lot of first fights and dominated a lot of rematches. Take from that what you will.

 

Virtually all of that situation was at MW in the 50's. The Turpin fight after fighting 8 fights in 3 months; the Fullmer #1 UD defeat; the Basilio #1 War SD loss.

Fullmer vs SRR #3 Draw

• A crowd of 13,465 produced a gross gate of $122,584.
• The promotion received $100,000 from TV rights.
• The fight was televised live on ABC, with a 300-mile blackout in the Los Angeles area.
• Fullmer received 40% of the net, and Robinson got 20%.
• The fighters wore eight-ounce gloves and fought in an 18-foot ring.
• The California scoring system was used, which gave the winner of a round one or more points up to five and the loser none.
• The Associated Press scorecard the fight 7-6 for Fullmer, and United Press International scored it 10-7 for Robinson.
• A UPI survey of ringside reporters showed fourteen scored for Robinson, six for Fullmer and three had the bout even.

Post-Fight Comments

• "Fullmer's a very rough guy to fight. You can't plan anything with him." - Sugar Ray Robinson
• "I'm no lover of Sugar Ray Robinson. Once when my manager and I tried to call him for a fight, he asked, 'Gene Fullmer? Who's he?' But I must say he's a gentleman in the ring." - Gene Fullmer

Fullmer vs SRR #4 UD Fullmer
Notes

• Fullmer was an 8-5 favorite.
• The promoters planned to have a ring that was about 16 feet, 7 inches inside the ropes, but Robinson threatened to pull out of the fight unless they got a larger ring. Also, after the commission decided that the fighters would wear eight ounce gloves, Robinson threatened to withdraw if the gloves weren't changed. As a result of his threats, an 18-foot ring was brought in from Los Angeles by truck and six ounce gloves were flown in from the West Coast.
• A crowd of 7,400 produced a gate of $140,000. There was an additional $150,000 from television.
• Fullmer got 40% of the net gate and $60,000 of the television money. Robinson got 20% and $50,000.
• Fullmer hurt Robinson late in the third round and battered him along the ropes. The beating continued 15 seconds after the bell because no one heard it.
• Robinson opened a cut over Fullmer's left eye in the third round, and Fullmer cut Robinson over his left eye in the tenth.
• Consternation struck both fighters and turned the Convention Center into a bedlam when the ring announcer misread the final decision and announced that Robinson had won. The mistake was soon corrected.
• After the fight, Fullmer said, "I'm glad I was fighting this guy when he was over his prime."

 

I think he carried a few fighters but never went into the tank for anyone.I'd say his acquaintance with the mob was merely peripheral.

 

Robinson carried a few for sure imo.

 

Ray didnt throw the fight to Maxim. Thats nonsense on the part of Burley, as is his claiming that his inability to get a title shot was because he “didnt play the game.” After the war he hooked up with Burston who was about as connected as you can get in any era of boxing. Burley had three main issues for why he couldnt get a title fight: 1. His prime coincided with the war, 2. As boxing ramped back up post WW2 Burley was declining, 3. He was percieved as being boring which more importantly resulted in him being a poor draw at the box office. The best, most connected manager in the world in that era isnt going to be able to move a guy who cant draw paying customers. Him talking trash about SRR just smacks of being bitter. Robinson didnt need the mob to fix fights or get him opportunities. He was one of the most famous fighters in the Western Hemisphere BEFORE he turned pro because of his stellar amateur performances. His turning pro was greatly anticipated, akin to what you see with Gold Medal Olympic champions today. That fame opened a lot of doors for him that most fighters, white or black, can only dream of. The fact that he continued to win, even when matched tough kept his fame and drawing power at the maximum and by the time he started losing fights as a middleweight it continued because he was a beloved fighter who was perenially percieved as fighting past his best and trying to climb the mountain one last time. Fans love that kind of thing and he kept pulling out these “against the odds” victories. It wasnt until after he was clearly in decline and basically fighting a littany of clubfighters for small purses in the last fews years of his career that his star power dipped. By then he wasnt worth the trouble of the mob and their hold on the sport had been dramatically weakened by the breakup of the IBC, the conviction of Carbo, and the senate subcommittee investigations into criminal activities in boxing. In short, the mob had its limits. Robinson was an island unto himself that they had very little influence on or association with. You couldnt operate in boxing at that time without knowing them, of them, or rubbing shoulders with them in some capacity but the actual influence on his career postive or negative is minimal beyond moving certain fighters into contention or into fights with him. In regards to him carrying people I believe this was less about carrying a guy for the mob than about Robinsons own temperment. Throughout much of his career he simply didnt kick it into high gear if he had a guy well in hand. He was always content to box and get a decision. If a guy got out of hand he could either keep him honest or get him out of there but it was much more his temperment to just stay in front of guy.

 

That's the most plausible analysis I've seen on this subject.

 

I think that's an insinuation that doesn't stand up to close scrutiny.

 

Excellent post!

 

Robinson was really ill after the Maxim fight his biography ,co- written by his son goes into detail about it.

 

I don't claim it does. Just an odd and exploitable pattern.

 

They made him an offer he couldn't refuse

 

Now Liston and LaMotta would have nothing to do with the mob!!!! No way, no how!!!!