Carlos Zarate was once 52-0 with 51 knockouts

wilder is, was and will never be even close don "ATG" steeles Level. no contest. in fact mentioning wilders Name in the same sentence as steeles carries a minnimum of 10 years Prison sentence in good ol bamma!!!!

 

I've always thought Mexican cab drivers were tougher than Berto

 

True but the average Zarate opponent en route to 52-0 was p4p >>> the average JCC opponent en route to 87-0.

 

Dissect Carlos and Julio's undefeated records. They're not as impressive as some people make it out to be.

I'm not going to go into it, but if anyone actually watched these fighters in their primes and saw them on a fight by fight basis, they'll know clearly that they weren't fighting top tier fighter's on a regular basis. By top tier, I mean top 5-10 in their divisions.

Imagine a long standing champion at a weight class defending his title against guys well outside of the top 10-15 in their divisions, how would that fighter be perceived in today's era?

Chavez is most notorious for padding his record. I remember when he fought Mayweather I believe in 1985, after winning his first title he went right down to mexico for his next 3 fights taking on guys that weren't even ranked in the top 25 in his division. Let that sink in for second.

Now a more modern undefeated fighter like Floyd got a lot of flack for taking on someone like Maidana after he beat Canelo Alvarez. Marcos was a top 5 welterweight and held a title when they fought and they called Mayweather a cherrypicker for that fight.

Imagine if Mayweather took on the garbage type of fighters that guys like Chavez were fighting in the peak of his prime. Julio only upped his level of competition by the turn of the decade, and by the 1990's he wasn't as invincible as he once was the moment he stepped up his level of competition on a regular basis.

But for about 5 years there, once he won a title, that guy literally was in fights against tomato cans that had no business being in a sanctioned fight against a titleholder. He was glorified and sensationalized at that time for his undefeated record, but no one ever made mention of the 50 plus garbage fighter's he fought against to stat pad his record.

The guy fought over 100 fighters in his career. I challenge anyone to mention 10 guys- just 10% of his fights- that he fought against that were actually top tier guys. We all know obviously DLH, Pea, Taylor. Name 7 more out of curiosity.

Let's try to put things in their proper context.

 

Ruben Olivares had a pretty sick record as a bantam.

 

ruben castillo
roger mayweather
rocky lockridge
juan laporte
edwin rosario
bazooka limon
jose luis ramirez
meldrick taylor
hector camacho
pernell whitaker

those are just before taking a loss, then you have a longer list of next level fighters that would probably be champs today, who he also beat.

 

100% correct in your assessment! Now look at Sal Sanchez's record. JCC would be a mere foot note in the history of boxing if good ol Sal hadn't gotten killed. Compare Sal's first 44 fights to Chavez's. You will see the difference between real greatness and perceived greatness.

 

I know, I was just adding to the TBE list up one upping the number of wins without a loss. Strength of competition has nothing to do with how one becomes TBE, just have the most wins without a blemish. 87-0 is the current TBE record to beat

 

That doesn't change what I said. I never said all 87 opponents were tomato cans, or that JCC never fought anyone even remotely decent before losing.

I said the average unbeaten Zarate opponent > the average unbeaten JCC opponent, p4p.

Zarate fought over a dozen guys in their debuts, sure, but he overall had enough guys of higher vintage to make his average LOC higher than JCC's during their undefeated runs.

 

i started to write that response then realized it didnt really disprove your particular statement, so i left it half written. when i replied to another post the saved function included your quote, thats why i edited the post soon after. or i thought i had.

 

Lost to Sweet pea, corupt ref in Taylor. Not impressed!