Why Oleksandr Usyk Is More Than Capable Of Moving Up & Dominating The Heavyweight Division.

You said you watched the Povetkin fight but then you make the statement "And he doesn't really use the lead hand to control distance nor his opponent" that is EXACTLY what AJ did past round 4/5 in the Povetkin fight. Did you watch it with your eyes closed? I can take screenshots because that is how he beat Povetkin by finding his range and getting out of Povetkins loopy range.

Every figther has weaknesses, and AJ ain't the most fluid on his feet, but he still found his range with Povetkin. I don't see how Usyk's movement is that much faster than Povetkin or Parker at all and I actually paid attention to his fights.

Joshua ain't bad at cutting out the ring, just because he failed to cut off ONE opponent in 22... give me and yourself a break man jeez. He stopped all of his opponent's except Parker... regardless of AJ's weaknesses he still win's, he's style still works, He still stops the opponent.

You can't name me one fighter that would beat him in a rematch today.

 

So far from the Usky hype train we've heard:

Usyk will be the fastest heavyweight - you can't catch him
Usyk has a great chin tested against - good heavyweights you can't drop him
Usyk ain't known for power but who needs power - power is overrated
Usyk will beat every heavy weight today via UD

Joshua won't be able to cut off the ring against Usyk
Joshua won't be able to catch Usyk
Joshua is incapable of knocking Usyk out
Joshua would lose to Usyk

Did I miss something?

 

Reminds me of a quote from the film Waterworld with Kevin Costner, a little girl describes her hero friend:

He doesn't have a name
So death can't find him
Doesn't have a home
or people to care for
He's not afraid of anything,
men least of all
He's fast and strong
like a big wind
He can hear a hundred miles
and see a hundred miles underwater
-He can hide in the shadow
of the noon sun
He could be right behind you, and you
won't even know it 'til you're dead!

 

Put this way,i'd love to find out if fight ever happens & Fury can move for a big man.

 

i didn't say "he won't be there to be hit", i said "as much".

The same goes for every weight class in boxing though...hence "disrupt their rhythm with the jab" line.

We've seen plenty of Usyk at heavyweight and the Povetkin fight proved AJ is vulnerable, that's about all that proved. Povetkin & Usyk are two completely different styles, so really it doesn't prove anything in terms of an AJ/Usyk fight

 

Right... to avoid a long winded analysis let's minimize this to its bare bones:

AJ got caught, but Povetkin is a great boxer. He took Povetkins BEST SHOTS period, multiple times, I even posted a thread on the punch stats landed. Was AJ in trouble? No he wasn't, and that's as bad as it is going to get for AJ outside of Wilder.

Bottom line, Usyk aint going to do a DAMN thing to hurt Joshua.

Next point, what happen when Povetkin got caught? He went down and almost out of the ropes. The second time? He went down so fast the referee had to catch him, and his trainer was jumping up and down in despair.

How many times has Povetkin been dropped or finished? Yeah that's what I thought.

So now we've agreed Usyk is GOING to get caught, he is also GOING to get slept as a result, 99% probability if he choses to trade.

He will get caught regardless if he runs, he has to get into range to punch Joshua and Joshua will counter, Usyk will not survive that power so he gets stopped.

Usyk ain't more of a threat than Parker or Povetkin in any shape way or form to Joshua at heavy weight.

 

And i myself amso wrote that he did start using lead hand control... you missed that part.
I just see Usyk as the far superior boxer.

 

Superior boxer in general or superior opponent to Joshua?

Simple answer, you believe Usyk beats Joshua?

 

usyk doesn't have to hurt AJ & that isn't the conversation we are having.

Povetkin hasn't fought anyone to put him in a position to be KO'd since Wlad. Against Wlad, he was in his prime, and more than likely on PEDs. Now 5 years later, at age 39 & after blowing his load in the first couple of rounds, he gets stopped and you don't see that correlation?

So he gets clipped once and gets slept? you genuinely think that? AJ doesn't have that sort of power to do that, unless he's fighting Zumbano Love.

He is a far, far more difficult test than Parker, and considering the time he fought Povetkin, he's probably more of a test than him as well

 

Joshua is one of the best finishers in the game, you are right he does not have one punch, but he's combinations are also the best alongside Povetkin so when he lands with the first sequence, the rest follow... I have plenty of proof for this if you want?

I guess we'll have to disagree then, Joshua beats Usyk no problem in my opinion at any stage during the coming 5 years. And if I am wrong I'll eat my words.

 

Yes, i believe Usyk beats Joshua.

 

You are one of the two best mods on here @CST80 , I like most of your takes and especially that you are self aware and good natured about arguing, unlike one or two other mods. And, you make as good a case as can be made for Usyk. But this is one where I will remain firmly in disagreement with you, unless or until Usyk dominates the division. Too much history is against him. In HW history, the dominant champions have always either had size, or power, or both. We've never seen a smaller than average fighter, who is not a ko artist, but instead relies on movement and skills, dominate the HW division. Holyfield is the closest who came to it, and on my cards he lost all 5 matches against the two best SHW's he faced. Byrd had a lot of success, and even got an injury impacted win against an ATG SHW. But he never established himself as a clear ATG and certainly never dominated the division.

If Usyk beats AJ, Fury and Wilder (or two of them, and doesn't face the third one, since one may retire etc by then), I will eat crow and admit that such a fighter can dominate and clear out a division. If he gets beat, will you admit its highly unlikely that someone with that style and skill set can dominate the HW division (smaller than average without top level power)? I mean, one thing I will definitely give you, if anyone can break the mold and do it, it should be Usyk.

 

Holyfield was the best heavyweight from the 90s, he gave Lewis a close fight in the rematch when he was past prime and he beat Bowe in the second fight on most cards.

He also beat Tyson when BOTH were past prime and he never got knocked out in humiliating fashion against inferior fighters like Lewis did.