P4P Floyd Mayweather Jr Vs Sugar Ray Leonard

What does that have to with P4P? When Floyd is the naturally smaller fighter?

 

I don't know what P4P means. The Green K.O. is probably SRL's most vicious K.O. at welter, and where a Floyd fight would be probably fought, and SRL put Green out cold.

"The final challenge for the WBC welterweight belt happened on 31 March 1980 against the holder Sugar Ray Leonard at the Capital Centre Landover, Maryland USA. Green suffered a devastating knockout in the fourth round being out cold before he hit the canvas. Referee Arthur Mercante, ruled that it was too dangerous to continue the count and stopped at six. The Times Newspaper reported " Leaning forward, dipping to left and right so that either hand could hit with equal venom, Leonard struck Green with a left and followed up quickly with a right-left-right, that started a clangour in Green's head, and the Briton crashed onto his back at the same place in the ring where Carlos Palomino had sent him toppling backwards.[2]" Green showed lots of spirit but he did not have the answer to Sugar Ray Leonard's masterly boxing skill and timing."

 

Floyd may have cherry picked and many of his best wins do carry an asterisk, but he still faced the best available guy there was to fight in 4 of the 5 divisions he competed in during his career.

No, Jose Luis Castillo isn't Duran...But he was a former lineal champion with some impressive victories over the likes of former divisional number one Stevie Johnston, and lineal champs in Corrales (over the weight) and Casamayor. We aren't talking a C class opponent or journeyman. We are talking about the best lightweight through the first half of the last decade. Floyd faced and beat him, twice officially- and twice on my card, FWIW.

Yes, the Pacquiao fight should have happened earlier (though I feel Pac should shoulder his share of the blame given his unwillingness to do Olympic testing back in 2010 when the fight was initially scheduled to take place). But he was still the WBO titleholder, and was coming off an official win over Bradley (who himself had decisioned JMM going into that fight). The fight was hardly insignificant...it was still a unification bout between two guys who were, though well past their best, still considered to be the best two fighters at welterweight. It would have meant more when they were in their respective primes, but unification bouts for the lineal title matter. Period.

Now, throw in Canelo and Corrales, and you've got four champions that are solid enough in an of themselves to land Floyd pretty deep in the top 50. Throw in guys like Hernandez, DLH, Cotto, JMM, Hatton, Maidana and a whole bunch of decent contenders on top of that and you've got a resume that's good enough to get him to Top 25, imo. Probably no higher than that, but no lower, either. Not too many guys have beaten their four best challengers in each division that they reigned or competed in, and those that do tend to be rated quite highly.

 

Even though we'll probably have to agree to disagree over the relative value of each victory and Mayweather's overall p4p position, you argue your point very intelligently so I can totally respect your views on this.

 

Thank you, Jel!

For the record, I can understand why Floyd can be so frustrating to rate. There were opportunities for him to face guys a bit sooner, or to face one or two different people, which would have made it much easier for some observers to rate him higher. I definitely get that.

 

How many times was Leonard stopped? How many times did he lose?

 

1. Sugar Ray Robinson
2. Harry Greb
3. Muhammad Ali
4. Willie Pep
5. Sam Langford
6. Roberto Duran
7. Ezzard Charles
8. Benny Leonard
9. Willie Pep
10. Joe Louis
11. Joe Gans
12. Eder Jofre
13. Mickey Walker
14. Sugar Ray Leonard
15. Tony Canzoneri
16. Jack Dempsey
17. Carlos Ortiz
18. Archie Moore
19. Jimmy Wilde
20. Barney Ross
21. Pernell Whitaker
22. Jimmy McLarnin
23. Kid Gavilan
24. Ike Williams
25. Bob Fitzsimmons
26. Packey McFarland
27. Emilie Griffith
28. Julio Cesar Chavez
29. Roy Jones Jr

 

That's not doing all that much for me tbh.

 

There's no way, no way Floyd beats Sugar Ray Leonard in his prime . The only question is does Floyd hear the bell

 

That is the purpose of weight classes. George Foreman (Hvy) vs Ricardo Lopez (Strawweight) PFP as
“El Finito” moves up to challenge Big George in an obvious shootout.

 

I have Leonard over Mayweather, and I don't like it one bit.

I believe Leonard is fairly overrated by most people, add into that fact he had few fights considering his lofty status, and you will see why I hate putting him above Floyd.

But this is P4P

Floyd himself I believe lost to Castillo and Oscar ( draw at least) and he fought lesser competition overall.

Floyd has the better track record overall, longevity, and a fantastic defense so I have him rated above Leonard all time.

But, Leonard achieved greatness, a level very few taste, and for a short time he was greater still than Floyd. P4P Leonard would beat Mayweather at their best. I have no doubts.

 

Head to Head at WW or JMW I'll take Leonard in a clear victory.

 

If you think it was unfair for many boxing fans to call Mayweather a runner... what if I told you that many boxing fans actually called Leonard a runner?

Good post but Leonard had the tools to beat all the Mayweather's... on a side not he did stop Floyd Sr. Leonard was bigger, taller, had a longer reach, stronger, faster, and punched harder. He was very durable and very elusive as well.