A primer: how 10-counts work (if a fighter is knocked down) and how they don't...

Oh please.

There was no point in the round where Ortiz hurt Wilder where the referee saw Wilder staggered, immediately stopped the action and let Wilder walk around for 21 seconds until he could prove "to the ref" that he could continue.

That's what the referee did in Wilder-Fury.

Wilder flattened Fury. And the referee made Wilder wait another 21 seconds before he let Wilder hit him again.

Ortiz rocked Wilder and bashed him all around the ring until the bell rang. Ortiz had every opportunity to stop Wilder in that round where he staggered him. Not only did he not stop Wilder, he couldn't even put him down.

And the action didn't stop until the bell rang ending the round.

How is that in any way like Wilder-Fury? It's isn't at all.

WILDER DID NOT have the opportunity to stop Fury. Because after he floored Fury, the ref gave Fury 21 seconds to clear his head before the ref felt Fury was okay to keep fighting.

You get 10 seconds. That's it. Not 21.

If Ortiz staggered Wilder and the referee decided to send Ortiz to a corner and give Wilder 21 seconds to clear his head after Ortiz tagged him, I'd agree with you.

But nothing remotely like that happened.

Wilder wasn't given the same opportunity against Fury after he buried him in the floor that Ortiz was given against Wilder when he had Wilder hurt.

I'm a fan of both Fury and Wilder.

But FURY GOT WAY TOO MUCH TIME TO RECOVER.

Way too much.

21 seconds is WAY TOO LONG.

 

Fury did get up on solid legs. And then the referee waited ANOTHER 11 SECONDS before resuming the fight.

You get 10 seconds to show you're ready to fight. Not 21.

The ref should've wiped Fury's gloves off the moment he stood and waived Wilder in. Fury got his 10 seconds. That's all you're supposed to get.

Not 21.

We've all seen hundreds of fights where the ref counted to eight, asked the fighter if he was okay, and then the ref waived off the fight regardless of what the guy said. Because the ref thought the guy wasn't ready to go.

And within a couple seconds, the boxer is running around complaining that he could fight.

You only get 10 seconds.

You don't get another 11 seconds for your head to clear more and then tell the ref you're okay to start fighting again.

If you're not ready to fight after 10 seconds, you lose.

I think Fury could've continued after 10 seconds, and the fight should've restarted. But the ref gave Fury 11 more seconds to compose himself.

That was WRONG.

 

May be true but hard for Wilder or his fans to argue this point when he got twice that against Ortiz.

 

No he didn't? Show me any moment in the seventh round where Ortiz staggered Wilder and the ref stopped the fight for 42 seconds and let Wilder regain his composure before he let Ortiz hit him again?

You're living in a fantasy world.

When Ortiz staggered Wilder, Ortiz bashed him until the bell rang.

When Wilder floored Fury ... Wilder wasn't allowed to resume the fight for 21 seconds.

That's too long by any standard.

 

THIS, THIS was getting “Extra time”

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How many extra seconds did Deontey get there??

 

That's wasn't the same round Ortiz hurt him in ... was it?

Ortiz was given every opportunity to punch away at Wilder in the round he hurt him in. Then the bell rang and the round was over.

Wilder was not given the same opportunity against Fury. He floored Fury and Fury was given 21 seconds to get up, walk around and regain his composure.

You're arguing something totally different.

And if a doctor visited the corner between rounds, the corner would've been given extra time and you wouldn't even have noticed. Extra time is given to the corner between rounds all the time when a doctor stops them from what they're doing.

The doctor should've visited between rounds.

We all know that.

But Ortiz wasn't cheated out of any opportunities when he had Wilder hurt in the previous round. He was given free reign to punch away.

You can't say the same about Wilder. If he'd been able to charge Fury after 10 seconds, instead of 21, the fight could've ended like Chisora-Takam.

Ortiz got to punch away when he had Wilder hurt.

Fury got a long break that he shouldn't have gotten.

If you can't see that, you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

 

No it wasn’t the same round... it was at the start of the very next round and Wilder was still on unsteady legs from the barrage the round before. And?? Deontey was helped! And given more time to recover! Period.


This who Tyson Fury long count crap has now been debunked hundreds of times. So has the notion he was aided by the ref in any way. Fury won that fight.

 

The ten count is approx 10 seconds, I agree. Approx ten seconds by which the knocked down boxer has to be ready to fight on. There's nothing in the rules of boxing that I am aware of that dictates the ref MUST call 'box on' immediately those ten seconds or so have elapsed, nor does there seem to be a guideline which dictates what is considered 'too long'.

How long from the knock down punch to the next exchange seems to be the remit of the referee, obviously within reason.

Was a further 10 seconds 'reasonable'? Let's dig a little deeper.

Jack Reiss informed both camps prior to the fight, in the event of a knock down he would ask the fighter to walk to the left and/or right in order to further check their capacity to fight on, as well as wiping the gloves which, as you say, is standard practice and, of course, he would ask the fighter if he wanted to continue and that would take a little time too.

I've not heard anything to suggest the Wilder camp objected to this further 'walk' test, either before the fight or since. So although 21 seconds is perhaps a tad longer than normal, it's consistent with the instruction he gave both corners. He was going to take his time as he was entitled to do, whichever boxer was felled.

This is what he has since been quoted to say about the KD....

'I said three, four... he was grimacing, his eyes and his cheeks, he was grimacing so I knew he was awake and then when I said five his eyes popped open like I startled him,'

'He rolled over and got up and said "I'm OK! Jack I'm OK" or whatever he said.'

'I said, "Do you want to continue?", he said "Yes" and put his arms on my shoulders. I pushed his arms off and said walk over there, come back to me and show me you're OK. He did and we let it go.'

 

A FURTHER 10 seconds is NEVER reasonable after a knockdown.

The clock is ticking. The round is in progress.

You knock a guy down, he has 10 seconds to rise. If he can't continue at 10 seconds, it's over.

That's WHAT THE 10 COUNT IS.

If the fallen boxer can't continue at the count of 10, it's OVER.

It's not a 20-second count. Or a 21-count. Or a "walk around for a while and let me know when you're composed enough to go on."

Tyson Fury got TWO 10 counts. One 10 count to get off the floor. Another 10 count to walk around until he was composed enough for the bout to resume.

That was nice of the referee to do.

But the fighter gets 10 seconds to get up and show he's ready to fight. The bout doesn't come to a halt until the fallen guy is ready to start fighting again.

Many fights are waived off WELL BEFORE 10 seconds have elapsed because the ref doesn't think the fighter will be ready at 10 seconds.

A boxer who floors another boxer should never have to wait 21 seconds for the match to resume while a ref decides if the fallen boxer who got up is OKAY to go on. He needs to be okay to go on after 10 seconds.

The clock didn't stop. Nobody had called "time."

At 21 seconds after he was floored by McCall, Lennox Lewis was standing on his own with his arms out with his cornermen around him yelling at everyone.

The history of the sport would be a lot different if people were given 21 seconds to recover from a single knockdown instead of 10.

 

Ortiz hurt Wilder in the seventh. He was allowed to punch away until the bell sounded. He didn't put Wilder down. The ref didn't call a halt to give Wilder 21 seconds to recover while Ortiz had him hurt in that round. Ortiz had his moment to stop Wilder. Then the round ended. And his moment passed.

The ref spent the whole count staring at Fury. When Fury got up, you wipe the guy's gloves and tell the two fighters to box or you stop it.

Ortiz never dropped Wilder. Nobody stopped Ortiz from hitting Wilder in the round Ortiz hurt him.

I can't believe people are actually arguing this.

Do you guys seriously not understand what a 10-count is?

Fury got TWO of them for the same knockdown. One 10-count to get up. Another to regain his composure.

By any measure that's wrong.

You all know it.

 

Based on your POV, possibly. But based on empirical evidence? Sorry, you've failed to make a robust case for the latter.

 

A fighter gets a 10 count to get to his feet, 10 seconds roughly to get to his feet, after getting to his feet and beating the count the refferee is obliged to make sure the fighter is safe to continue, it is up to the refferee to make that decision. The fighters safety is paramount at this point. He can make that decision by giving the fighter a thourgh check over.
He can stop the fight at any point of the fight,so why wouldn't he after seeing a fighter take a heavy knock down?
I agree that the wilder Ortiz situation was completely different, as wilder had just had the full break to be checked over,it was obviously giving him extra time as he was treated for cuts that clearly weren't there.

 

It's not ten seconds that's for sure....

The count and the checks carried out after a boxer has committed to carry on fighting - ie: the total time from the KD punch to the fighters boxing on - is at the discretion of the ref, within reason. Logically, because the 10-count should only take approx 10 seconds, and with checks still to be made once it's been established the fighter wishes to box on, the length of time the fight is paused HAS to be more than 10 seconds because the gloves need wiping and the ref needs to ask the fighter if he is okay to continue etc. And both fighters are then ushered into position to re-engage and the ref gets between them and only then orders 'box on'. All this adds time over and above the nominal 10 seconds.

In this specific case the ref wished to carry out another test too which also took time.

He actually went to the trouble to outline, prior to the fight, what he would do in the event of a KD and then followed that to the letter. 21 seconds is reasonable based on what he said he would do, to which neither camp apparently objected.

I'm sorry DC, typically you're an excellent poster with whom I often agree, but you've backed yourself into a corner over this one. You don't make a persuasive case on this occasion.

 

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Fury was up before the count tolled, end of story. AND, if we still had 15 round fights like we SHOULD, he would have starched Wilder in the 13th!!