In what weight class would Marciano fight today?

he could easily make 168 by removing water, then re hydrating to 180-85 by fight time. He was slow at heavyweight, he'd still be small for a 168 pounder, and even slower compared to the other fighters at that weight. His time was the 1950s and those times have passed.

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I'm not convinced that Marciano was "cutting" 25-30lbs per fight throughout his career. Has anyone seen any sources discussing the first few years of his career? I think that people tend to over-generalize from a few anecdotes and specific training camp situations at the tail end of his career.

Other than the quote that you attribute to your coach's son, I've never heard or read anyone suggesting that Marciano looked too drained at the lighter weights. I'm no Marciano expert but I just haven't seen anything along those lines.

Dawson seems like an extreme case and not necessarily representative of what would happen to a younger man (Dawson was 30 and hadn't fought at 168 in 6 years) who was regularly coming in at 178-181 the day of the fight without draining himself. I just don't buy that draining a few pounds and rehydrating over the next 24 hours would have been dangerous or unusual for a young fighter in Marciano's position. And I suspect that most boxing people (trainers, managers, network people, etc.) would have seen him as being far more viable as an up-and-coming light-heavyweight than a small cruiserweight or extremely undersized heavyweight.

 

Marciano himself along with Goldman always talked about Marciano having to go Six months or longer without sweets and having an extremely strict diet because otherwise it would throw his weight off. Goldman mentioned trying to do the same with Bonavena, but that Bonavena would never stick to a diet and according to Goldman Bonavena never came close to performing to his potential. Also, If you notice in his first fight Marciano came in over 190 lbs.

Marciano like Dempsey held most of his weight in his legs. Dempsey himself back in the day was training down from 225-230 and would sometimes go a day without eating just to be sure he hit his target. Wilder also mentioned having one day when he goes a whole day without eating solid food.

Also, Dawson is just one of many examples of fighters that pushed cutting too far and ruined their bodies. Archie Moore, Roy Jones, Orlin Norris, etc... are just a few other fighters that ruined their bodies with pushing weight cutting too far. I see a lot of people mentioned rehydration, but rehydrating isn’t the same as your body being comfortable, since I’ve seen many fighters, wrestlers, bodybuilders, etc. collapse due to cutting one too many pounds. Floyd Mayweather wasn’t willing to shave off an extra two pounds when he fought Marquez for a reason.

Since you say it wouldn’t be dangerous to shave off a couple of pounds when a guy is already trained down to the bone I have to ask if you’ve ever competed as a division 1 college or pro athlete?

Also, trainers, managers, and network people can be wrong a lot of times, since Marciano wasn’t even really seen as a viable fighter at any weight back when he started in the 40’s due to his limited amateur experience, height, reach, etc.. I’ve seen more fighters than I can remember ruined because their trainers and managers placed them in a division for superficial reasons rather than based off what was comfortable for their body and ability level.

A perfect example is Medzhid Bektemirov, who was about 5’9” and walked around at about 200-205, but his best fighting weight was between 185-188. He had excellent power, but because of his height and reach his management forced him to cut down to 175, which was a big mistake and even down to 168, which he didn’t come close to making. He could’ve easily been a champion at cruiserweight and even made some money at heavyweight.

 

Glad I'm not the only one who noticed! It's awful man all the current champs should be a fighting at a weight or two higher. Wish they would go back to same day weight ins! Good Valid Point!

 

You know I'd be inclined to agree but, Marciano had a style that was well suited for a bigger opponent. Would fight from a crouch get those guys to punch down while countering with that Susie Q, plus guys don't have near the work volume nowadays that Marciano would bring. He would have great success in this modern crusierweight division in my view!

 

Can you refer me to any particular sources with Goldman discussing specific details about Marciano's diet and weight management? I don't see any direct evidence for your characterization that he was already "trained down to the bone" early in his career, at least not trained down to the bone any more than the countless other pro fighters who drain themselves down a few pounds for their weigh-ins. Any written sources that would support that claim would be greatly appreciated.

The other examples you mention--Moore, Jones, Orlin Norris, etc.--don't seem any more applicable than the Dawson analogy. You're talking about guys who are making major swings in weight from fight to fight, and usually later in their careers. I don't see what that tells us about young Marciano making 175 on a 24-hour weigh-in.

The question of this thread is what weight class Marciano would have fought at. You seem to acknowledge that trainers, managers, and others would likely push him toward a lower weight class, which is all I'm claiming. Whether they'd be wrong about what's best for him is beside the point. (And I'm not sure what you base your opinion about Medzhid Bektemirov on, but having not followed his career it's not obvious to me that he would have done better at cruiserweight).

And what's your basis for saying that Dempsey was training down from 225-230? And is it your contention that he regularly weighed that much between fights and had to lose that much weight in many of his training camps?

 

I've never really understood the logic behind this argument. Whether he's crouched or not, it's still going to be a lot easier for skilled 6'3-6'6 opponents with much longer reaches to find his head with jabs and straight punches than it would be for him to land wide power punches on them, no?

 

Yes sir, good valid point! Mike Tyson, Joe Fraizer, David Tua, Holyfield all small heavyweights who were able to close the distance and apply effective pressure even with the size disadvantage. Marciano, in my view is to small for heavyweight nowadays but would do just fine in the crusierweight division. Like the latter he would have no trouble closing that distance and applying pressure. Marciano's skill was very underrated, gets credited for have this granite chin, but his ability to slip and roll with a shot was very impressive! In fact if you watch film of him he very rarely gets caught clean, rolls with alot of shots making the punch a glancing blow instead of a flush shot!

 

Yep
Although I still say he would be a HW at some point in his career. I don’t see why Tyson, Tua, Frazier, Tooney all of whom were the same height or smaller could contend and win but Marciano would struggle...that logic seems off with me as Marciano has many skills that would allow him to thrive today. Power in both hands, stamina, and a great chin would do him very well in today’s division...but I think he would do more of a Roy Jones and just pop up from cruiser for one or two big money fights.

 

Good points man!!!

 

He would have to choose between competing with guys that would be 20-30 lbs heavier than him in the ring or guys that would be about the same size as himself weight in the ring, and probably making more money in the process. If he would go for the bigger guys for less money he would perhaps be the first to make that choice. So my guess is that he'd go for LHW.

 

I don't see this. I have always been under the impression that Marciano's walking-around weight was over 200 and that he trained down to 185 plus for his title defenses. Am I missing something here?

 

My understanding is that he only hit 200 toward the tail end of his career, when he was inactive and over-eating. The man had a legendary appetite and apparently was known to pig out at times.