So long as we say that both technique and physical gifts go hand in hand, and conclude that more oftent han not, physical gifts are bigger factors in success with the best athletes/fighters in history. Technique only takes you so far when you lack the physical gifts, but gifts alone can take you ALL the way.
I'd say common sense indicates when muscle mass increases to the point you lose speed and timing. Most people are way off this mark but elite fighters will be close to it.
But how is it measured in our context? Someone tell me. It's all well and good spouting "diminishing returns!!!" But how do you measure that in boxing.
please reread all my posts on the subject, i said exactly that... apparently in a very confusing form.
Take Felix Trinidad for example. He probably never touched a barbell in his life. Are you implying that if he started doing heavy squats that he would begin to punch even harder? He hit about as hard as a 147 pound human could hit. There is a limit to how hard a 147 pound man can possibly punch. And he was pretty much at that level.
Like you measure anything. For one thing, one-off power is not going to be that massive a concern. Would you bulk up 40 pounds to get that extra 10% - no because your heart will be pounding out your chest just to keep you alive. That's the issue practically! Theoretically, in the lab, that's down to the individual and their body type.
Same, since I've hit the weights all over my body, I've been hitting HARDER and FASTER, I haven't slowed down even in gaining muscle. The bag is moving a lot more viciously, and I've documented everything on video. Furthermore, I can not hit my heavy bag with full force, no wraps or gloves, without hurting myself simply through conditioning and weight lifting improving my wrist strength.
If he started powerlifting squats he'd put on more weight and would no longer be 147, all other things being equal.
That is not a good enough answer. There are many things in this world we cannot measure. So try answering it again.
The returns just aren't great enough to justify weight training in a boxer's training program. The first problem is there aren't enough hours in the day without over training. Morning workouts are generally conditioning - long runs, springs, hills, stairs etc. Weight training does not supplant this. Ever. Afternoons at the gym are for boxing. If a man is training properly for 2-3 hours, there's not much if anything left over for a quality lift. Then there's the weight issue, boxing is governed by weight classes. Heavy lifting puts on mass. Sure, lighter weights don't....but no amount of light weight training will supplant pullups, chinups, pushups, dips and corework which are alreay the building blocks of every boxer. Diet is another problem. You can't lift for strength and power without putting in the proper nutrients otherwise your muscles won't repair properly and you're just tearing up your body. If you are eating properly then your body is going to grow (right out of the weight class)
It's extremely variable. Do you think Eddie Hall can hit even as hard as Amir Khan? If you wanted to make Hall a Boxer you'd have to trim him up because he's way too big to access his full power potential. Despite deadlifting 500kg or whatever. Look I'm not saying this is an issue for the normies and club boxers. Lift away. But of course there's a ceiling for top level pros. Otherwise a solid chinned lightweight could just bulk up to 200 pounds
There is a limit to how much a 147 pound man can punch? Do you realise the ignorance in that statement? Maybe if we were in a comic forum we could argue yeah, he can't punch through steel... human limit I am afraid. But a 147 pound man can come in many different shapes and forms. You can't talk about limits, when you can't even measure how hard they punch. Apparently everyone here has denounced the PowerCube measurement device for striking... not my problem.... but willling to use that in some of our theoritical testing.
