Rank these attributes in order of their importance to greatness

It's what surprised the poop out of Holmes and totally ruined his otherwise perfect game plan against Tyson. I think Larry was expecting a short Foreman lol.

 

I don't know...Foreman didn't have great hand speed and wasn't especially accurate. Try leaving him off a top ten list.

 

I think you have to have the IQ to work on the fundamentals and the discipline to keep practising until your fundamentals because second nature and then your sharpnes can develop, if you are in shape you will harder to knock out you are easier to knock out when you have bad stamina, being relaxed in the ring and knowing how ride shots or know what to do when you`re hurt is more important than having a good chin, having good leg stamina can help you recover from being hurt also, if you develop a good ofensive IQ you can wear a fighter down with out having a big punch or you learn how to punch to te body, even soft punches can have an effect downstairs, so offensive skill is more important than a punch, and speed in a punch can make the blow have great impact, so that means speed is more important than power if you know how to punch correctly, putting your legs into a punch along with your hips.

 

Holmes was landing enough on Tyson but the power difference was also too much, having said that Tyson`s hand speed was the reason Holmes couldn`t get away and his brilliant punch picking and timing, the punch Shavers hit Holmes with was harde than the right hand Mike floored Larry with but Tyson followed up far better than Shavers because all Earnie had was power, Mike would have finished Holmes if he had him in the trouble that Earnie had Larry in during the 9th round.

 

heavyweights are a different thing all together. The weights make things unpredicatable. Most great fighters have some sort of unique handspeed. From what I can see.

 

'Fatigue makes cowards of us all'.

 

Great Post Mark. As I boxer, I agree with you.

Great fighters can fight properly from pure instinct, it's so instilled.

'You can only fight the way you practice'
Musashi Miyamoto

'Rhythm is everything in boxing. Every move you make starts with your heart, and that’s in rhythm or you’re in trouble. Your rhythm should set the pace of the fight. If it does, then you penetrate your opponent’s rhythm. You make him fight your fight, and that’s what boxing is all about.'
Sugar Ray Robinson

 

You wouldn't consider Ali mentally tough? Or having exceptional mental toughness?

 

And that's my main complaint about most world class fighters today. Their not instinctive, when I watch fights today, it seems to me at least their actually thinking about what they should do. Instead of instinctively seeing where the opening will be and reacting to it before it opens. Since you quoted Miyamoto . I will quote Lee Jun Fan, with " I don't hit,it hits all by itself". And that only comes through untold hours in a gym or dojo.

 

Foreman is not a top 10 great fighter. He was very beatable at the top whether in 1970s or 1990s. Top 10 great heavyweight? Maybe, but he lost a lot of title fights. He was powerful but very beatable.

 

So let's get this straight, Foreman was very beatable but was 40-0 by the time he fought Ali, and had the complete destruction of a great heavyweight champ and had defeated convincingly a number of contenders prior to the championship on his resume? Then he returns 10yrs later in 1986 after retiring in 1976 at an age most athletes (esp pro fighters) are long retired, goes on to win the heavyweight championship again in 94' against a good (and undefeated) boxer named M.Moorer? Ok.

 

Stamina
Mental toughness/heart
Defensive abilities/reflexes and technique
Durability and chin
Ring IQ and the ability to adapt on the fly
Professionalism and consistency
Mobility and footwork
Punching precision and accuracy
Punching power
Handspeed
Luck and chance
By tomorrow I will probably switch a couple. But honestly they are all damn important

 

A lightheavyweight Michael Moorer, Moorer was never a great champion at heavyweight and he didn't take a good punch. Holyfield rarely knocked guys out, and he stopped Michael. He had some great wipe out wins against Norton and Frazier and then lost to Ali and Young. He lost to Evander and Morrison. He had a great style match against guys who stood in front of him and took the power and he did not do well when guys neutralized him and moved and made him miss. I wouldn't say that is unbeatable or top 10 great of all time. No way. He lost 2 out of 3 times he fought for the title in his comeback. And his first career was not long enough to say all time great. Where is the greatness pound for pound for Foreman? It is not there. He was exciting. Yes.

 

Happens to us all. It happened to me last week when I totally messed up JohnThomas thread about bringing in a fighter to face these guys. It had been awhile, I glanced over the opening post thinking I knew... and I was totally wrong. It happens.