1990s Lightweight round robin (minus Artur Grigorian)

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Jel, Mar 25, 2019.


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  1. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    "Inspired" by @Ra's Al-Ghul's frankly ridiculous assertion that Artur Grigorian was the 6th best lightweight of all time, it got me wondering whether Grigorian was even the 6th best lightweight of the 90s. I decided he probably wasn't, but wondered which 6 were better. I figured these half dozen were:
    Pernell Whitaker
    Oscar De La Hoya
    Shane Mosley
    Miguel Angel Gonzalez
    Stevie Johnston
    Orzabek Nazarov

    So I wondered how they would do against each other if they'd met in the ring. Does anyone go 5-0? Does anyone go 0-5? Who comes out on top? Who would be bottom of your list?

    And do you think Artur Grigorian would beat any of them?
     
    Jel, Mar 25, 2019
    Jel, Mar 25, 2019
    #1
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  2. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond Ridin' the rails... Full Member

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    I actually like Orzubeks style. An aggressive technical standout like Yuri Arbachakov, not as good as Yuri though.

    But he wouldn't beat the Great Grigorian. Who would?
     
    roughdiamond, Mar 25, 2019
    roughdiamond, Mar 25, 2019
    #2
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  3. Xplosive

    Xplosive Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yes, Whitaker would go 5-0. He was clearly the best of them.

    To be honest, I'd probably favor all of them over Stevie Johnston, minus Grigorian, who loses to all 6.
     
    Xplosive, Mar 25, 2019
    Xplosive, Mar 25, 2019
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  4. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    Yes, I think Whitaker is the standout here and I can't see any of the others beating him, so 5-0 doesn't seem a stretch at all.

    After that, though, I think there are some very competitive matchups here. It's just a shame that they didn't come off.
     
    Jel, Mar 25, 2019
    Jel, Mar 25, 2019
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  5. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    He achieved more than De La Hoya at LW in the 90s... only in your Teutonically-obsessed dreams.

    Grigorian had no credibility as a LW champion whatsoever - zero, zilch, zip. He held the most lightly regarded world title version and chose to defend it in the relative comfort of his adopted homeland and avoid meaningful challenges.

    Hey, that's fine in and of itself. He retired in good shape and hopefully made some decent money - that's a success story in itself in this sport.

    And I don't blame him for any of that. It's not his fault someone is making baseless assertions about his greatness and suggesting he's the 6th greatest lightweight of all time.

    But when you post things like that it just makes you look ignorant and very silly. And means you have no credibility as a poster in this forum.

    Look, I'm genuinely not trying to insult you. But just consider that the way you post means that it's hard to take your views seriously, that's all.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2019
    Jel, Mar 26, 2019
    Jel, Mar 26, 2019
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  6. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    The Forum's Joke!
     
    mcvey, Mar 27, 2019
    mcvey, Mar 27, 2019
    #6
  7. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    You guys can laugh all you want, but I would wait until you have watched Grigorians highlight reel that I uncovered.

    This content is protected
     
    PhillyPhan69, Mar 27, 2019
    PhillyPhan69, Mar 27, 2019
    #7
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  8. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Highlight? It must be a short one!
     
    mcvey, Mar 27, 2019
    mcvey, Mar 27, 2019
    #8
  9. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    Nah, I remember it intimately. De La Hoya dropped Ruelas in 2 and Ruelas was not past his prime - he was as good as he ever was when DLH trounced him. Oscar also stopped Genaro Hernandez in 6. I didn't need to check boxrec for that info - that was just basic recall. Now, let me recall Artur Grigorian's achievements during the same era... nope, nothing.
     
    Jel, Mar 27, 2019
    Jel, Mar 27, 2019
    #9
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  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Ruelas was the reigning IBF champion his record was 43-1-0, he was just 24 years old,he would box for another 4 years,having12 more fights and losing just 2 one of them to Kostya Tzyu.
     
    mcvey, Mar 27, 2019
    mcvey, Mar 27, 2019
    #10
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  11. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    The action at 17 hrs 32 mins and 5 seconds is just immense!
     
    Jel, Mar 27, 2019
    Jel, Mar 27, 2019
    #11
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  12. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    This content is protected
     
    Jel, Mar 29, 2019
    Jel, Mar 29, 2019
    #12
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  13. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    This is absolute nonsense Ruelas was the reigning IBF Champ with a record of 43-1-0 and he was just 24 years old.
    He would fight for another 4 years and lose just 2 fights.
    Grigorian fought a procession of unranked nobodies for a paper crown he never rose above number 7 for the whole time he was ranked by the Ring.Nobody agrees with your ludicrous ranking of him,so what does that tell you?
     
    mcvey, Mar 29, 2019
    mcvey, Mar 29, 2019
    #13
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  14. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Rubbish!
    George Scott was ranked as follows.

    1995 Title Vacant
    1. Oscar De La Hoya
    2. Miguel Angel Gonzalez
    3. Orzubek Nazarov
    4. Stevie Johnston
    5. George Scott
    6. Philip Holiday
    7. Shane Mosley
    8. Leavander Johnson
    9. Lamar Murphy
    10. John John Molina


    1996
    Title Vacant
    1. Orzubek Nazarov
    2. Philip Holiday
    3. Stevie Johnston
    4. George Scott
    5. Jean-Baptiste Mendy
    6. Shane Mosley
    7. Leavander Johnson
    8. Ivan Robinson
    9. John John Molina
    10. Artur Grigorian

    1997
    Title Vacant
    1. Orzubek Nazarov
    2. Shane Mosley
    3. Stevie Johnston
    4. Philip Holiday
    5. George Scott
    6. Azumah Nelson
    7. Israel Cardona
    8. Jean-Baptiste Mendy
    9. Artur Grigorian
    10. Cesar Bazan
    You will note that Scott was ranked above Grigorian in all 3 years!
    In Fact Grigorian Never Was Ranked Higher Than Number Seven!


    You will further note that Scott achieved his ranking by defeating Ruelas who was ranked number2 in1994 !

    1994
    Title Vacant
    1. Miguel Angel Gonzalez
    2. Freddie Pendleton
    3. Orzubek Nazarov
    4. Rafael Ruelas
    5. Sharmba Mitchell
    6. Dingaan Thobela
    7. Joey Gamache
    8. Jean-Baptiste Mendy
    9. Miguel Julio
    10. Leavander Johnson
    1995
    Title Vacant
    1. Miguel Angel Gonzalez
    2. Rafael Ruelas
    3. Orzubek Nazarov
    4. Oscar De La Hoya
    5. Miguel Julio
    6. Leavander Johnson
    7. Shane Mosley
    8. Stevie Johnston
    9. Billy Schwer
    10. Ivan Robinson
    * Ruelas was also number 4 in1993



    So if, as you assert George Scott was ,"an unknown second tier boxer"
    what does that make Grigorian?lol

    Mister, you are a complete comedy show!
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2019
    mcvey, Mar 29, 2019
    mcvey, Mar 29, 2019
    #14
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  15. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    Your lack of self-awareness and your inability to recognise irony are truly breathtaking.
     
    Jel, Mar 29, 2019
    Jel, Mar 29, 2019
    #15
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