Joe Louis vs Sonny Liston

To rehash what I have said previously on the issue, I think that Louis's hand speed would be the deciding factor, but Liston obviously has options.

 

Liston would be an extremely live dog but I still take Louis by late round stoppage

 

Conventional wisdom is Louis is the much better fighter and I agree,,but, Joe does not give many angles or movement and Sonny has the longer harder and superior jab. I'd make Joe the favorite but Sonny could pull an upset and blast Louis out in about 8-10

 

Funny screen name. Jake Lamotta was 24 having sex with a 14 year old girl and then beat her. Yet you have respect for him?

Second Louis had to put on weight through out his career. He weighed as low as 181. When Louis fought Conn in 1941 he still weighed 199. So most of Louis Career he weighed under 200 pounds. Sonny Liston is extremely overrated on forums like this where 99 percent of the people on it don't know anything about boxing and are casual fans. Liston's best wins were against the 180 pound glass chin Floyd Patterson and the slow lumbering Cleveland Williams. Some how that makes him unstoppable on forums like this. Joe Louis on the other hand spent his who career finding guys who by modern standards would be considered club fighters. He never fought a modern sized black heavyweight in his career. The black guys he did fight like Jersey Joe Walcott who weighed 190 and Ezzard Charles was 175. Neither were modern sized heavyweights.

Sonny Liston had a better chin, only going to down a few times in his career. Joe Louis chin was pure glass. Even light punching Billy Conn hurt him. Louis was slow footed and stood right in front of his opponents. Liston would of intimidated Louis and knocked him pretty quickly. I couldn't imagine anything Louis could do to last more than a few rounds.

 

He was my fathers favourite fighter, and I think I admire the man more than most, but I would have to pick Liston. I think in these fantasy h2h matchups he beats a lot of great fighters.

As a side note, I think Liston was a hell of a fighter. It’s a pretty unfair thing that you can do with many other fighters, but I can’t help but wonder what the man would’ve been able to do if he didn’t lead such a horrible life. His father beat the hell out of him regularly, he ran away and turned to crime and discovered boxing in jail. The life of crime continued and even when he became champ no one wanted him. He was apparently nice to those close to him, such as his wife and reporters who would give him the time of day.

He had such natural tools though.

 

Rock on, mad dawg! You’re off to a helluva start. My greatest struggle right now is whether I’m more enchanted by your boxing analysis or your people skills

 

I guess I am going to have to get used to lookin at perty people, and perty people going to have to get used to lookin at me.

 

Just letting you all know: this is my favorite SuperFight in not just heavyweights but all of boxing. Tremendous battle between the 2 best fundamentally sound heavyweights of all time.

Can't pick a winner. This is torturous. Need help...

 

Before taking a bullet in his gut Cleveland Williams had speed, skill, and was fast moving on his feet, a good match against many top heavyweights.

Floyd weighed 189 for his first go against Sonny, Jersey Joe weighed 195 against Louis, and Ezzard weighed in at 184 for his title go against Joe. Floyd isn't considered to have had a glass jaw, he got up from almost all his knockdowns, he could be hurt and dropped and was. Aside from the race of those he fought Joe fought a number of big men in Abe Simon, Buddy Baer, etc. Weight wasn't a factor in any of those wins, he fought and beat all the top men, every generation of top fighters can only be asked to do that, those were the modern standards of his day.

Jake wasn't a nice guy in the day and that's according to Jake, there's no argument there although he thought he was portrayed worse then he was in Raging Bull. As a boxer and champion he was great, in many top ten's and deservedly so.

 

I used to think Liston was over rated till you analyze his record. He was THE dominant force and avoided by most in his time. He didn’t just beat Patterson and Williams he cleaned out the division beating many of his opponents while they were prime. I would take another look at his record. Back to topic I think it would be a great fight with Louis definitely getting knocked down and Liston finally wilting in the 7 round area if and only if Louis can get Listons respect with his own speed and power early.

 

I am not talking about who was good for their era. I am not talking about how dominant somebody was in their era. I mean comparing Liston to champions who came after him. Floyd Patterson was still a 180 pound glass chin fighter. Cleveland Williams wasn't that good. Those were his best two wins. So like I said compared to Foreman , Ali, Frazier, Ken Norton, Lennox Lewis, Riddick Bowe, Mike Tyson and others Liston isn't that good.

Why would Liston wilt? Because he did against Ali? Ali was much harder to hit than Louis was. Also Liston was past his prime against Ali and didn't train hard. A prime Liston wouldn't wilt. A prime Liston wouldn't have chance to wilt since Louis wouldn't be able to take this punch.

 

After the 1956 fight with Marty Marshall, Prime Liston very seldom went beyond 7-8 rounds excepting for two 10 rd fights with Bert Whitehouse (April & Oct 1958), and the 12 rd fight with Eddie Machen in Sept 1960.

Louis won't change his own style to boxing & moving like Machen, so it's going to be a slugfest from Rd 1 on til somebody gets stopped.

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Lol which has nothing to do with Jake being a pedophile who beat up on women. You act like all boxers are pedophiles. Most boxers never commit a crime a day in their lives. Watch you make a excuse for that too.