Thrilla in Manila

Nighttrain knows what he is talking about.

There was too much personal pride at stake for wither guy to come in out of shape. Ali may well have thought Frazier was in decline, and may well have tried to give the impression that he wasn't training for the fight, but he would not have wanted to run the risk of losing to Joe...it was way too personal between the 2 of them.

Further...a man out of shape CANNOT fight the way Ali did in the championship after absorbing the level of punishment he had taken during the fight.

 

Frazier gave Ali hell in their first two bouts. To think Ali would come into fight three out of shape is just hogwash. The weigh in days before the fight made it appear he (as well as Frazier) was over normal weight. Over the years the unknowing looking back on the weights and not understanding the details extrapolate that Ali's weight was high and he did not train hard. Nothing could be further from the truth.

 

Ali may not have trained as hard as he COULD have for Manila but he was still in pretty good shape. After three fights previously in that year he never had a chance to get seriously out of condition. Had to have been a very fit man to have outlasted a determined Frazier.

 

You're literally so stupid.

 

Absolutely the savage classic. Long live Smokin' Joe Frazier! You tell him I'm coming and hell's comin' with me, you hear, HELL'S COMIN ' WITH ME!!!!!!!

 

True, no one fights 14 hellish fast paced rds weighing over 200 lbs in estimated 120 f. and not be in shape.

 

Yea. The fight itself is proof enough that Ali was in great condition. That was the fastest paced heavyweight fight I ever saw. Ali was punching with bad intenions from the opening Bell.
The chaos around Ali's extramarital affair didn't deter his training. Ali was used to having a hurricane swirling around him. He actually needed it.

 

Really enjoy yr posts EMT. OUTSTANDING POSTER.

 

excellent

 

I recall Joe saying he never forgave his corner for stopping it, I always wondered what the 15th would have looked like. Ali shot his bolt in the 14th and actually told his corner to cut off the gloves after that round. I think Joe just might have been stronger had the came off the stools....

 

I don't believe that nonsense about Ali was about to quit. The guy who said he heard Ali say cut the gloves was one of Fraizer friends lol Dundee denied Ali said cut the gloves and he was in front of him. I know an argument made that Dundee is bullshitting as well , but in the video on youtube he comes across like he is telling the truth. Ali was in full control, it's just to hard to imagine.

 

Dr. Ferdie Pacheco when asked about it not only didn't deny it, he said we all wanted to quit at that point. The guy who heard it was Willie the worm Monroe and he was trying to get Fraziers corners attention when it was stopped. Ali had a good 14th , but he was hardly in full control. After the fight Frazier cleaned up and went out with his entourage, Ali lay curled up on his bed

 

Agreed, Ali said after the first fight,,,to fight Joe Frazier you have to be in condition! Hard to imagine he'd show up for a 3rd Frazier fight out of shape and the fact is nobody, but nobody would have lasted that long that night against Frazier out of shape.

 

I believe it 100%. Ali after the fight said it was the closest thing to dying he had ever felt. I think AliAli s "cutthem off!" when he got back after the 14th. He had just thrown a busload of punches in the 13th and the 14th. In a fight that was both long and brutal. Consider the heat element as well..

It would be far fetched to think he didnt say it. Its natural. Saying 'cutthem off!' and actually quitting are two different things though. Dundee had no authority to stop it anyway.
I think both would have gone out for the 15th. Joe was in bad shape too only anger kept him on his feet the previous 2 rounds.