Teddy Atlas says Tyson isn’t close to being an All Time Great [2017]

Atlas seems bitter to me.

 

In fairness to Atlas, I think the time a teenaged Tyson allegedly threatened to **** his young niece might have something to do with it.

 

Spot on . And if losing like that to Buster make s you a quitter then Joe Louis must be, doing the same thing to Schmeling !

 

Yes, I know all of this. Stretch, yawn, back to bed.

 

Teddy’s always had an axe to grind against certain fighters, especially Tyson. In many ways he’s a slightly unhinged and dishonest character when it comes to certain people. Personally, looking at where Mike is now, how far his come and the things he has overcome in and out of the ring, is the best proof that he is an all time great fighter. He’s managed to overcome things that would crush an ordinary man. And when it comes to his ring record, let’s not forget he was an underdog going into the Spinks fight, the Douglas fight proved he had heart, Holmes might have been old but he wasn’t a bad opponent. Tyson is an ATG and none of Teddy’s biases ramblings are going to convince anyone otherwise.

 

Holmes was actually a worse opponent in some important ways than Spinks. MS didn't go nearly two years without fighting, wasn't underprepared, wasn't coming off of two straight losses...wasn't a newly minted grandfather.

There were plenty of heavies at the time who would have beaten the Tyson Larry. I can see Thomas, Tucker, Bruno and Page beating him at that point (of course, I see them all getting stopped by 1980 Holmes).

That said, I really like the rest of your post.

 

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Yeah...I thought that rang weird. Don't recall the odds, but I also don't remember anyone I knew giving Spinks a chance...even for a decision victory. He was the underdog and so was Larry (rightfully so in both cases).

Sometimes I wonder about otherwise-quite-knowledgeable-and-likeable people here who were either too young or not-born during the tenure of guys like Tyson and Ali. You really did have to be there.

Mike by the time of the Holmes fight was already blowing people's minds and causing not-quite the fever that Ali did, but not sensationally far either. He was (in retrospect a bit prematurely) being considered for AT greatness as early as the Berbick victory. He was truly a cultural phenomenon that hasn't existed since. Might have been the most reliably entertaining fighter in the division who wasn't Ali.

 

I too see Mike as an ATG, but in the top 15. There were too many other great fighters who had more heart and stamina for him to crack that top 10 imo, including two men who came after (Holyfield and Lewis...I'd mention Bowe if he'd gotten the Lewis fight out of the way back in the day).

 

When he was living boxing he was a great fighter. That other lifestyle changed him. He never wanted to box after Givens and especially Douglas. He didn't love it

 

It works both ways though, Tyson lived boxing more than any of his opponents Holyfield included. One would assume they would have tested him more and they been more dedicated.

 

It is 37 years since Atlas was expelled from Catskills boxing club by Cus D'Amato. He pulled a gun on 15 year Mike Tyson after he grabbed the buttocks of his 11 year old niece.

 

I believe you've seriously underestimated both of them and their love for Tyson.

I do agree with your overall point.

 

Tyson was the big fave. 4-1 from memory and that was after the odds shortened.

 

The only fight Mike Tyson was ever underdog in was against Lennox Lewis in 2002, I think.