My Video on Jack Johnson

You can quite clearly see Willard cut off the ring before he knocks out Johnson.

 

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You can definitely see Jeffries is trying to push Johnson into a side or corner, he just couldn't.

 

Yeah, how can you trap Johnson into the corner when he just clinches you and moves to the other side? Jeffries matched his strength early on, but he was quickly gassed and then Johnson started to push him around with ease (around 4th round). Jeffries was 230 lbs man with wrestling background, how someone like Rocky or Tyson would fare better in that particular situation?

 

His examples are also off. Frazier cut off the ring against Ali because Ali tried to dance away from Frazier. Johnson wouldn't dance, he would tie him up and fight in the clinch. Completely different situation.

Moran used left in a similar way to Baer - he just wanted to judge the distance and find Johnson with his right hand. His approach was much different than how Louis fought.

Burns and Flynn wanted to be inside against Johnson, because they couldn't deal with Jack's left from outside and both were shorter than him. Johnson was simply too strong for them on inside.

 

Very interesting points well spelled out. There is no doubt that the sport has evolved. Some men had skills to evolve

 

Nice post .. of course the game has morphed . Some men had skills that could have morphed with it while others were more limited. While I happen to believe Johnson was one that could have morphed it does not change that fact .. in addition this issue is more important at heavyweight where the size and skill level of so many fighters has changed.

 

Regardless of the skill level, Johnson has one of the best resumes of all time at heavyweight.

 

I think the article made clear and accurate points.


In order for Johnson to morph to a more modern decade of boxing:

1 ) The first thing he would need to do is clinch / hold / then hit less, which was a foundation of his game vs. the shorter or much older. This type of style wasn't tolerated past the 1930's.

2 ) Secondary, he would need to throw more than 10-15 punches a round, if he is to win on points vs. anyone decent.

3 ) He would actually have to face top 1-5 ranked fighters as champion, which is something he did not do form 1909-1914

4 ) His defense would need work. While Johnson had good reflexes and punch anticipation, he had a low guard, and mostly stationary feet. With a 74" reach, he would be at the mercy of a good jabber, and his chin when hit cleanly and tested was not so good, which means the power punchers he would face can get to him too.

The days of heavyweight champions who are 6 feet tall and have modest power are officially over. I don't think he'd do well in the past 50 years of heavyweight boxing, but he could make a very interesting cruiserweight if he had the discipline to say at that weight.

 

Wladimir Klitschko didn't clinch and hold? Why was he nicknamed Wladimir Clinchko then?

Ali didn't clinch and hold?
Ali had a low guard ,so did Tunney.

 

You can say that Johnson would be small for today HW division, but 50 years ago? He was bigger than many 1970s "greats" including Frazier.

 

Yes he would be small at 6'1/4" and 208lbs, but would be heavier than Dempsey 6'1" 188/190lbs.[5 of his9 title fights at or under188lbs].

As big as Louis 6'1'1/2"205lbs, [20 title fights under 205lbs].
And bigger than Marciano 5'10" 185.187lbs.[3 of his 7 title fights under 186lbs].
Many give those three a decent chance against todays heavyweights.

 

Silly. Some of the greatest defensive fighters who ever lived fought with what you term a low guard. A great defense does not require ones gloves to constantly be covering their face. Head movement, slipping ducking and great footwork are the basics of defensive boxing.

Johnson had the best defense of any hwt champion and his feinting tied opponents in knots.

Johnson is hit “holding” or “clinching”. He is controlling. He allows the punchers if the day to get inside and beats them at their own game. Taps to an opponents elbows take all the power from body blows while punches to the head are blocked. This is graphically shown in his filmed bout with Flynn. Flynn gets inside, he is able to punch and he does body and head. However if you watch closely his body punches are muffled. Then punches to the head are caught by Johnson’s gloves and Flynn’s arm is immediately brought back down to control position. The ref of this bout stated afterwards that “Johnson was NOT holding and Flynn was free to punch at all times”.

Johnson’s skills are subtle and like most fighters filmed during the silent film era skills must be closely look for. Back in the 70’s one of the first boxing films I purchased was this fight and I watched in religiously in slow motion. Johnson skill set blew me away. One sequence I have never forgotten. Flynn is ineffectively trying to body punch and then throws a short left hook to Johnson’s head. You can watch frame by frame as that punch heads towards Johnson chin. Just as it’s about to land there is Johnson’s right glove to block the blow and he catches the punch as if it hit a brick wall.

 

Switching the topic to others so soon?

No Wlad did not clinch, hit and hold, and he almost never fouled. He did clinch sometimes, but lots of heavies do this. Johnson's offense in part was built around hitting and holding, so there is the difference and something he would have to overcome in a more modern setting.

Ali and Tunney moved their feet, Johnson didn't always do this.

Wlad would destroy Johnson in 2-3 rounds by the way, but we all know that.

 

Ref from Johnson’s bout wiling Flynn:

“Johnson was not holding. Flynn was free to punch at all times”.

Why? Johnson was not clinching or holding. He was controlling his opponent. Very complex technically was Johnson. Watch him a bit more closely. An amazing fighter of a very high skill level.

 

I mentioned Wlad in response to this inaccurate comment from you.

" The first thing he would need to do is clinch / hold / then hit less, which was a foundation of his game vs. the shorter or much older. This type of style wasn't tolerated past the 1930's"

Wlad clinched a lot and had no inside game what so ever.
Ali clinched a lot .
Lewis clinched and uppercut in the clinches.
You spout rubbish!

You need to watch Wlad lay all over Povetkin and Haye.

Johnson didn't have to base his defence around movement because his anticipation and interception of punches was better than both Ali's and Tunney's.