When did in-fighting at HW stop being a thing?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019.


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  1. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very feel me good. Full Member

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    One trend I see in a lot of old-school (pre1940s) HW matches is how much clinch fighting there was, usually a high 'horns locked' style clinch followed by chopping uppercuts and body shots while trying to walk each other back to the ropes. This wasn't relegated simply to the smaller fighters, but to the big guys as well, who'd often give up their height advantages to duke it out on the inside (see Buddy Baer vs Joe Louis).

    Needless to say, no one at HW fights like this now, but why? When did clinching become a more acceptable tactic, and why did the scrappy sort of in-fighting that was the bread and butter of most of the old schoolers die out? And would this style of fighting still have success today, or would refs allow it to just descend into John Ruiz style clinchfests that they would fail to properly enforce?
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2019
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
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  2. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    It's still a thing lol. The art has just diminished. The ruleset is less favored to it sure, but I suspect it's because the art is mostly at a low point right now. Not many great infighting trainers. Bowe was the last great infighter imo. Right now Andy Ruiz can infight ok.
     
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 1, 2019
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 1, 2019
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  3. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

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    Emmanuel Stewart
     
    George Crowcroft, Sep 1, 2019
    George Crowcroft, Sep 1, 2019
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  4. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very feel me good. Full Member

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    Sorry, perhaps I should be more accurate with my terms. I'm specifically referring to clinch in-fighting, whereby both fighters will engage a clinch but rather than completely tying up will continue to fight before (generally) breaking up on their own volition to continue boxing at range.

    Bowe's a good modern example of what I mean though.
     
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
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  5. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Throw boxing skill out the window. Hwts today want to range fight. No need for endless precise training. No need to really know how to fight. Just keep your opponent at distance and hold on in close until the ref breaks you. Garbage boxing.
     
    HOUDINI, Sep 1, 2019
    HOUDINI, Sep 1, 2019
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  6. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    My point still stands. Ruiz is ok at it. But refs typically disallow it.
     
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 1, 2019
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 1, 2019
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  7. GALVATRON

    GALVATRON Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Heavyweights average 6'5 that's why. It's a long game now more then the 6'3 and under guys more then not.

    Still decent inside / mid range guys at 6'5/ plus are Joshua, Fury , DDD , Bakole , Mahkmoduv come to mind ...some of these guys are prospects but they are big decent inside fighters to.
     
    GALVATRON, Sep 1, 2019
    GALVATRON, Sep 1, 2019
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  8. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very feel me good. Full Member

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    Ruiz doesn't really do what I was mentioning in the above posts. Rather, he dukes it out on the inside, using his great chin and fast hands to out-strike fighters in close quarters. When he clinches it's generally to tie up.

    Perhaps I should post some videos of what I mean, but my internet connection is playing up a bit so I'll have to leave it for now.
     
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
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  9. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very feel me good. Full Member

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    Yeah, but like I said taller fighters back then did it as well. Was this just because a style hadn't been developed yet to take advantage of their size, or would a jab n grab style of a Wlad type result in DQ back then?
     
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
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  10. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    Ruiz was hitting Joshua in the clinch, but I know what you mean. Like I said, refs don't allow Dempsey-Firpo esk clinch fighting anymore. Hell the only reason Ruiz got away with the stuff he did is because he was fighting in America
     
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 1, 2019
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 1, 2019
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  11. GALVATRON

    GALVATRON Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Tall wasn't the norm back in any era .

    Even in the 90's finding guys over 6'4 was limited its why Lewis stood out , now it is the norm and train better bc they have to and are much better balanced today. Fans don't realize but it takes good balance to throw hard at 6'5 ,its why Wilder falls over his own punches bc he is top heavy and throws with everything hes got which throws him off balance,you'll see almost always one foot comes forward and he loses balance.


    fighters back then clinched more it was taught to hold and hit ,fans just don't want to believe it and criticize modern times but the truth Ali was a bigger clincher then Wlad at times, yet Wlad has a great Knockout percentage . Which one is more entertaining was Ali but that's bc he was not able to dominate like a wlad who won easily ,due to size/skill and just strength .Whos better ? That's subjective but Wlad can shut you down and out much easier then Ali could..
     
    GALVATRON, Sep 1, 2019
    GALVATRON, Sep 1, 2019
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  12. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very feel me good. Full Member

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    Baer vs Scheming illustrates what I mean.

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    Here's Baer vs Louis doing the same thing.

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    Carpentier vs Dempsey.

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    That kind of high, lean in clinch, that still leaves plenty of space to leverage bodyshots and uppercuts, and isn't so smothering that it completely shuts down the action.
     
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
    It's Ovah, Sep 1, 2019
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  13. BitPlayerVesti

    BitPlayerVesti Boxing Drunkie Full Member

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    Not heavyweight but I watched a bit of Hatton recently and he was somewhat old school in his in fighting.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2019
    BitPlayerVesti, Sep 1, 2019
    BitPlayerVesti, Sep 1, 2019
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  14. HOUDINI

    HOUDINI Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Such inaccurate statements.

    Prime Ali was not a clincher. Only specific bouts such as Frazier 2 and Spinks 2 can you find excessive clinching.

    Wlad made a career out of it. It was part a huge part of his style.
     
    HOUDINI, Sep 1, 2019
    HOUDINI, Sep 1, 2019
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  15. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    And look at what Joe Cortez did to him for that!
     
    Seamus, Sep 1, 2019
    Seamus, Sep 1, 2019
    #15
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