Benny Leonard and Modern Technique

mcvey · Nov 12, 2019

Cecil said: ↑

Does anyone know who Ray Arcel rated higher Leonard or Duran?
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Arcel never trained the light weight version of Leonard.Benny was all through when Arcel worked with him at welterweight,he came back because he had been wiped out in the crash.

Cecil · Nov 12, 2019

mcvey said: ↑

Arcel never trained the light weight version of Leonard.Benny was all through when Arcel worked with him at welterweight,he came back because he had been wiped out in the crash.
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I hadn't realised that.
Although thinking about it, if Arcel had been there at the start of Benny's career, he would have been a pretty young guy.

Samtotheg · Jun 18, 2021

reznick said: ↑

His counters and pocket craftiness were just excellent.

On a side note; at 6:54 of the Tendler fight you can see Leonard throwing the same uppercut people here mocked Corbett for in the Tunney training footage.
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joe gans also throws this uppercut and jim drisccoll is on film doing it

louis54 · Jun 18, 2021

KasimirKid said: ↑

I am in possession of a letter written by Arcel to Jack Fiske on March 18,1980, which reads in relevant part:

"Dear Jack: -

"Good hearing from you----------
Your request to compare Roberto Duran and your list of many of the GREATEST lightweights of all time is a 'ticklish' one as it is so very difficult to make comparisons.

"I have been associated with Duran for eight years and in that period of time I have been able to understand this young man and have watched him improve from time to time. He has always been able to adjust to different styles and been able to cope with the situations that arose in the ring. That is the mark of a top-notch campaigner. I always felt that Roberto Duran could have been right on top of any lightweight division. If he were not the champion-----he would have been a leading contender.

"Benny Leonard, in my opinion, was the greatest boxer, pound for pound, that I ever saw. He was THE champion of the best lightweight division anyone has ever seen since 1917. Anyone of the leading contenders of that period could have been champion if Leonard was not there. I honestly feel that Duran could have fit into that group and prove his ability with the outstanding stars of that period. Duran's strength and punching powers could have made it possible for him to more than hold his own with all the champions who followed Leonard. What a thriller a Duran-Henry Armstrong fight would have been. Tendler might have proven a problem because of his excellent southpaw style---but Duran would have been dangerous all the way. Ross, Canzoneri, Ike Williams, Lew Ambers, Jimmy Carter, Charlie White, Billy Petrolle, Beau Jack ARE DREAM MATCHES-----but Duran would have proven his ability with everyone of these fine champions.

"This is my opinion, JACK, and I know there may be many who will disagree...... But I am writing to you about a young man I know so well---and trying to compare styles and abilities with others whom I also knew so very well.

"I have been active in boxing since 1916----have trained and handled eighteen world champions. I studied and understood styles and abilities of most boxers. The element of surprise was taught to confuse an opponent.....and Duran has learned that lesson very well. He can box as well as fight."

Click to expand...

KasimirKid said: ↑

I am in possession of a letter written by Arcel to Jack Fiske on March 18,1980, which reads in relevant part:

"Dear Jack: -

"Good hearing from you----------
Your request to compare Roberto Duran and your list of many of the GREATEST lightweights of all time is a 'ticklish' one as it is so very difficult to make comparisons.

"I have been associated with Duran for eight years and in that period of time I have been able to understand this young man and have watched him improve from time to time. He has always been able to adjust to different styles and been able to cope with the situations that arose in the ring. That is the mark of a top-notch campaigner. I always felt that Roberto Duran could have been right on top of any lightweight division. If he were not the champion-----he would have been a leading contender.

"Benny Leonard, in my opinion, was the greatest boxer, pound for pound, that I ever saw. He was THE champion of the best lightweight division anyone has ever seen since 1917. Anyone of the leading contenders of that period could have been champion if Leonard was not there. I honestly feel that Duran could have fit into that group and prove his ability with the outstanding stars of that period. Duran's strength and punching powers could have made it possible for him to more than hold his own with all the champions who followed Leonard. What a thriller a Duran-Henry Armstrong fight would have been. Tendler might have proven a problem because of his excellent southpaw style---but Duran would have been dangerous all the way. Ross, Canzoneri, Ike Williams, Lew Ambers, Jimmy Carter, Charlie White, Billy Petrolle, Beau Jack ARE DREAM MATCHES-----but Duran would have proven his ability with everyone of these fine champions.

"This is my opinion, JACK, and I know there may be many who will disagree...... But I am writing to you about a young man I know so well---and trying to compare styles and abilities with others whom I also knew so very well.

"I have been active in boxing since 1916----have trained and handled eighteen world champions. I studied and understood styles and abilities of most boxers. The element of surprise was taught to confuse an opponent.....and Duran has learned that lesson very well. He can box as well as fight."

Click to expand...

Great post

Jel · Jun 19, 2021

KasimirKid said: ↑

I am in possession of a letter written by Arcel to Jack Fiske on March 18,1980, which reads in relevant part:

"Dear Jack: -

"Good hearing from you----------
Your request to compare Roberto Duran and your list of many of the GREATEST lightweights of all time is a 'ticklish' one as it is so very difficult to make comparisons.

"I have been associated with Duran for eight years and in that period of time I have been able to understand this young man and have watched him improve from time to time. He has always been able to adjust to different styles and been able to cope with the situations that arose in the ring. That is the mark of a top-notch campaigner. I always felt that Roberto Duran could have been right on top of any lightweight division. If he were not the champion-----he would have been a leading contender.

"Benny Leonard, in my opinion, was the greatest boxer, pound for pound, that I ever saw. He was THE champion of the best lightweight division anyone has ever seen since 1917. Anyone of the leading contenders of that period could have been champion if Leonard was not there. I honestly feel that Duran could have fit into that group and prove his ability with the outstanding stars of that period. Duran's strength and punching powers could have made it possible for him to more than hold his own with all the champions who followed Leonard. What a thriller a Duran-Henry Armstrong fight would have been. Tendler might have proven a problem because of his excellent southpaw style---but Duran would have been dangerous all the way. Ross, Canzoneri, Ike Williams, Lew Ambers, Jimmy Carter, Charlie White, Billy Petrolle, Beau Jack ARE DREAM MATCHES-----but Duran would have proven his ability with everyone of these fine champions.

"This is my opinion, JACK, and I know there may be many who will disagree...... But I am writing to you about a young man I know so well---and trying to compare styles and abilities with others whom I also knew so very well.

"I have been active in boxing since 1916----have trained and handled eighteen world champions. I studied and understood styles and abilities of most boxers. The element of surprise was taught to confuse an opponent.....and Duran has learned that lesson very well. He can box as well as fight."

Click to expand...

That's good enough for me.

ETM · Jun 19, 2021

Benny Leonard died way too soon. He was a relatively young man. Saw a documentary on him years back that had a friend of his saying "Benny always said he would be involved in boxing until his last breath." Turns out he literally was. Leonard died in the ring when he was referee.

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