Too much focus on deciding Tua can beat Marciano is based on his powerful frame. One thing is sure there was nothing artificial about the solid 201 David weighed as a debutant pro. Samoan or not. 201 was what he weighed when he started his career. At that starting point, with all the wonders of modern sports science at his disposal Tua weighed just 201 and was a still a very strong looking, fully developed youth much like Mike Tyson at a similar age. At 5'10 I wonder what Tua would have weighed with a traditional pre 1970s boxing training programe. I wonder what he might have weighed for his debut in 1947? ...and I wonder how much heavier Tua would have gotten several years into his 1950s career considering that Mike Tyson COULD keep within 5 pounds of his 18 year old weight TEN years into his career in the 1990's? Tua was brave, had qualities that I can aknowledge but ultimately his career panned out to prove at the best level he was one dimentional and always fell short at top level. Marciano was a counter mauling presure fighter. Two handed power and proven at every level available in his time. Awkward to hit cleanly by more proven accurate top level punchers than Tua. Marcianos cleanest blows were powerful enough to produce serious periods of trauma and unconsciousness right through the levels.
Since you somehow forgot to mention it I'll do it for you.Tua was 20 years old when he turned pro and he grew progressively heavier as he matured into his body .
You are correct. He developed rather in much the same way our dear freind Orlin Norris did. What do you make of 5’9” Orlin Norris? When he wanted to be a heavyweight Norris was in line with Tua. He turned pro at 199lb aged 20. (Tua turned pro at 201) then Norris Grew to 227lb contender (who beat Greg Page, Renaldo snipes and Tony Tucker) all within four years as an exclusive heavyweight. Then aged 25 Norris dropped to 189lb on a whim to become a cruiserweight. After four years of being mostly a cruiserweight Norris again leaped from 188 to 220 to campaign as a 220-246 heavyweight. After another few years of that Orlin incredibly dropped down to cruiser in his late 30s. Amazingly Norris was 196lb for his very last fight aged 40. That’s four pounds lighter than his debut 20 years earlier. Astonishing for a 5’9” guy who was as high as 246lb. Now don’t tell me this was not all down to Norris benefiting from the era Tua puffed himself up in.
Sorry Mac never realised his previous! thought on this thread you both seemed to be singing from the same hymn sheet, although obviously he in a more bombastic way!
and so would David Tua be a cruiserweight. He was 201lb for his first fight, lighter than mike Tyson was in his first fight and Mike was slightly taller and still able to scale within 5 pounds of his 18 year old weight TEN years into his career in the 1990's. Because the era Tua fought in a fighter could weigh anything they wanted. It was simply a matter of tactics or discipline. The training and dietary programs had changed irreversibly from Marcianos day. But the truth is Rocky was 196lb on his debut. Tua was 201lb. So as a starting point you are looking at the same ballpark. So far as size goes, the only difference is the time they fought in. Michael Moorer rose to the top in that era but Rocky Marciano can’t? Don’t forget Tua did not make the grade. This nonsense that because both Tua and Ike were huge Punchers against other fighters it therefore proved they each had “the best chins on the planet” . This is pure mumbo Jumbo. Ike himself has said he was not sitting down on his punches. There may have been very little holding but inside they were not hurting each other. No damage to either man. Because they were either too close or too square. At times they really were swinging properly but they were not getting those kinds of connections because it was a step up in class for both of them. Ali and Frazier landed better punches. Look at their faces after the first fight! As enjoyable as Tua v Ibeabuchi was it did not represent an elite fight. Simply a good fight between evenly matched prospets. If either fighter wound up being great after that the best you could say was it was a match between great fighters before they were great. Trouble is of course neither fighter wound up being great because their potential was not realised again. Tua got fat and Ike went mad. And what era do these guys come from who are able to “grow big muscles”?
I'm so torn. Tua isn't very good but is horrible for Marciano. I think I'll say Marciano wins a UD, but is dropped early on.
I can only handle one inanity at a time. Tua was a heavyweight and fought heavyweight every fight of his career but he would not be a heavyweight? Comparing Tua and Tyson proves nothing. Two different fighter, two different career arcs, two different sets of genes... two different everything. Typically, these head to head fantasy match-ups are best versus best. That means a 187 pound Marciano versus a 225 Tua. Unless you want to move the goal posts (yet again), that is the match-up.
Really? I have a good argument to go 184 from the first Walcott fight. Or 185 from Lastarza but chose the Charles weight. Again, when backed against the wall of reality, the Marcianista creates fiction.
He did at least beat a few guys ranked in the top ten. I submit that Tua's reputation as a wrecking machine is the real fiction here!
Indeed, he did very well against name fighters ranked outside the top ten! Marciano on the other hand has a legacy!
I understand that the man with the better resume doesn't always win, but when the gap is this big you have to have serious doubts!
