If a boxer completely dominates a round but suffers a KD, how should the round be scored?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by IntentionalButt, Dec 12, 2019.


If a boxer completely dominates a round but suffers a KD, how should the round be scored?

  1. 10-8 for the party that dominated but scored the KD.

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. 10-9 for the same, if you believe the adversary truly dominated, enough to completely offset the KD.

    50.0%
  3. 10-10 if you felt the dropped party was so dominant as to have otherwise deserved a 10-8.

    50.0%
  1. IntentionalButt

    IntentionalButt Guy wants to name his çock 'macho' that's ok by me

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    So, this concept was originally thought up by @uhd100 - but the poll in uhd's thread included a couple of downright fallacious options that betrayed a lack of understanding of how boxing's "ten-point must" system works. So we have to scrap his OP and poll, and start fresh.

    To be perfectly clear, you cannot score that hypothetical round (or Wilder vs. Fury round twelve, in particular) 9-9 or 9-8. There's no such thing as scoring a round in pro boxing where at least one combatant isn't awarded ten full points. You cannot, under any circumstances, do that.

    ("what about a situation where the fighter that wins the round is deducted a point from the referee for a foul? Isn't that 9-9?" you might ask. Well, yes and no. Yes in that functionally the round posts 9 points to each man's total, but in the scoring column for that individual round a pro judge would put 10-9 for the winner...and then separately, in the fight subtotals column, would mark 9 points for each, subtracting a point from the winner extraneously to his base score in that round. Ya dig? If not, that's a problem. Re-read it until you understand, and don't go crowing about how 9-9 or 9-8 or 9-5 or 9-anything rounds - or anything other than an individual round base score of "10-something" is feasible. Because it really isn't...)

    A is never an option. Why? You can't have a "9-9" round (you can have a round functionally be one, if the ref deducts a point for a foul, but not for a knockdown - but even the referee point deduction for a foul is still a 10-9 round within the official column of the judge's score-sheet, with the point deducted in a separate totals column). You do not can cannot ever supersede the impetus of "ten point must" for a knockdown.

    C is never an option. Same reason as for "A". One fighter must get a "10" in the individual round's column on the judge's official scoring sheet. You can have the winner of the round only get 9 points over in the separate totals column, only for a deduction for a foul, never for a knockdown. In a round where there are no deductions for a foul, at least one fighter gets ten points, no matter what.

    The options should have been presented as:

    10-8 Wilder (conventional scoring, the majority of times in this situation)
    10-9 Wilder (if you think Fury truly dominated the round, enough to completely offset the knockdown)
    10-10 (pretty outrageous, but still technically an option, unlike the first & third options given by uhd; this would be if you felt the round was so dominant in favor of Fury that, minus the knockdown, you would have scored it a 10-8 round for him even without him dropping Wilder)

    That's all. Those are the only realistic options, within the rules. Option #1 is the one that 99% of fans and 99% of pro judges are going to agree is correct. A vocal minority could make a case for option #2. The last is really a ludicrously out-there choice, but still, a judge would not be in violation of the rules if they scored it thus (just showing very poor subjective judgment). There is no latitude for a pro judge to score a round (again, within the individual round's base scoring column) as 9-9 or 9-8. Zero. They do not have that option, ever. The job isn't subjective to quite that degree. They can't just write in whatever they want. You can't submit a round score of "50 kajilleon googleplex to negative four", because that's nonsense. Likewise, a 9-9 or 9-8 round is nonsense. Gobbledygook. Not an option.

    Here are the original poll results:

    Poll Results: How do you score it?

    Members who voted for '10-8'
    • Jennifer Love Hewitt
    • FrankinDallas
    • Goose
    • Pimp C
    • nervousxtian
    • rodney
    • McGrain
    • Keleneki
    • Babality
    • Sandman_
    • lufcrazy
    • KO KIDD
    • Reppin501
    • Lith
    • Anima
    • DKD
    • MetalLicker
    • trololopunch
    • SuperROB87
    • glovesofcrimson
    • RingKing75
    • ForemanJab
    • ellerbe
    • Eel87
    • Boon
    • BiggieL
    • Stonehands
    • GK BOX
    • 12toneman
    • MrTombourineMan
    • Contro
    • stormenic
    • JordanK2406
    • Gymbot
    • DTM
    • LitoCandela
    • Dance84
    • Heavy_Hitter
    • Veys9
    • 'Warpath'
    • tommoalex
    • George Crowcroft
    • piprules
    • Pakkuman
    • HitmanMG
    • JabbaTheGut
    • ColmC


    Members who voted for '10-9'
    • valdosta
    • Daddy
    • innewst
    • spiderricco
    • demigawd
    • Nopporn
    • rinsj
    • bruce_keyes
    • Robney
    • MisterSinister
    • NoNeck
    • On The Money
    • nurological
    • kiwi_boxer
    • lewis gassed
    • Chutz
    • speedbaggage
    • goku23
    • lordlosh
    • DoubleJab666
    • robfosters
    • It's Ovah
    • Ryan28
    • 2manyusernames
    • J555
    • Greg Price99
    • Stiff Jab
    • Zishan hussain
    • Jacdaniel
    • Uponthangs

    Members who voted for '9-9'

    Members who voted for '9-8'

    • Members who voted for 'Dereck Chisora'
      MrFoFody
      velagod
      CST80
      ryuken87
      DanielDimov
      PrinceNaseemHamed
      uhd100
      El Meza
      blackfella96

    ^ :lol:

    So, yeah... all of you in the fourth & fifth groupings there, who voted for either 9-9 or 9-8... along with fellow "10-point must" deniers @Chiefit420 and @DavidC77 - I'm going to need you all to reply to me with sworn affidavits that you a) understand why your vote is wrong and not possible under the rules of scoring the sport and b) promise to not go around disseminating falsehoods to confuse any newbies or fellow uninformed fans.

    You're going to all do this within the next week, okay? If you don't (and I click on your name and see you've logged in since at least an hour after I tagged you in this post), you're no longer going to have privileges on this forum. :rosstheboss
     
  2. uhd100

    uhd100 New Member Full Member

    50
    74
    Nov 8, 2017
    Example Wilder Fury Round 12.
    I have scoured the internet and can't find a concrete answer.
    Do you:
    A) Score it a 10-9 to Fury then deduct a point for the KD so 9-9?
    B) KD trumps everything else so it's 10-8 Wilder and the rest of the round is irrelevant?
    C) Score it a 10-8 and then deduct a point from Wilder for losing the round so 9-8 Wilder?
    D) Something else entirely?
    Any experts know what should technically happen?

    Edit: if you disagree that Fury dominated the round, pretend he did. It's a technical question!
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
  3. Pakkuman

    Pakkuman I'm not hot. I'm just BIG. banned Full Member

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    A knockdown is the biggest event aside from a knockout in a round. 10-8 always.
     
  4. Scorpion

    Scorpion Boxing Addict Full Member

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    10-9 Wilder if Fury really did dominate but Fury didn't dominate round 12 so it is 10-8 in reality.

    Fury did better but he far from dominated.
     
    PIRA, lordlosh, Frankus and 3 others like this.
  5. Boon

    Boon Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    Fury did not dominate round 12.

    It was a clear 10-8 round.
     
    Frankus, heerko koois, MURK20 and 4 others like this.
  6. Dirsspaardis

    Dirsspaardis Boxing Addict Full Member

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    You can’t have a round where neither fighter gets 10 points so options A and C fly right out the window right there.

    Then it’s either 10-10 or 10-9 in favour of the fighter who scored a KD.


    Edit: I take that back, can’t be 10-10 because it’s starts with, in your example, Wilder getting 10-8. So only 10-9 is possible IMHO.
     
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  7. covetousjuice

    covetousjuice Putin did nothing wrong

    6,862
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    Apr 21, 2015
    I think a KD is generally accepted to trump whatever else happened. So 10-8.

    I guess if it really was just a super dominant performance vs a weak KD... 10-10?
     
  8. titanic

    titanic Boxing Addict Full Member

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    So they rally ****ed up the Pac-JMM 1 scoring
     
    George Crowcroft, Bofo24 and Pakkuman like this.
  9. LoadedGlove

    LoadedGlove Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Most sanctioning / governing bodies order a mandatory 10-8 when a knockdown is scored. I am well enough stricken in years to remember when Referees, who in the UK also scored fights, could make their own minds up. The general rule of thumb was that you couldn't lose a round if you knocked your opponent down but I've certainly seen rounds scored even.
     
    Ph33rknot and Bokaj like this.
  10. JamesLightsOutToney

    JamesLightsOutToney Respect to all boxers Full Member

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    Jul 4, 2019
    What if each fighter scores a KD? You would not have a fighter with 10 points anyway

    To me, it's 9-9 given that the fighter who suffered the KD really dominated. Imagine if the KD is a borderline slip, it would be weird to give a fighter who is dominated for the whole round the 10 points, right?
     
  11. _Scott_

    _Scott_ Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Always 10-8, no matter what happened besides the KD
     
  12. Alphafighter

    Alphafighter Active Member banned Full Member

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    Dec 4, 2017
    How was Round 3 of AJ Ruiz 1 scored?
     
  13. destruction

    destruction Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Given the fact I have seen 98% of judges scoring it as 10-8. It is 10-8
     
  14. Robney

    Robney ᴻᴼ ᴸᴼᴻᴳᴲᴿ ᴲ۷ᴵᴸ Full Member

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    I know it's custom to score a knockdown round 10-8, but in many cases scoring it that way is completely unfair.
    There have been fights in which a boxer was clearly dominating a round, then suffered a flash knockdown, off-balance shot, or even bad referee call on a slip, which prompted a sudden 3 point swing 10-9 Boxer A became 10-8 Boxer B.
    Boxing scoring is already really flawed, and those situations make it even worse.
    I only score a 2 point swing in those instances, and even those seem a bit unfair.
     
    PIRA, Boxing Prospect, rinsj and 2 others like this.
  15. Goose

    Goose Russian oligarch Full Member

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    You can't dominate a round and getting KDd at the same time, by definition