Choose the best Heavyweight in boxing history.

I wouldnt say he had one more impressive than that. When you hold a title for 11+ years and 25 title wins that is unequaled. Undisputed champion. Before Louis won the title maybe a little over a year he had been pro he knocked out Primo Carnera and Max Baer with less than 2 years pro experience. Both recent champions. Then he loses to Schmeling and returns to beat Sharkey, another former champion.
So apart from his actual title reign Louis had 3 former champions notched on his belt. Just some perspective. Louis did more than anyone else. We can't let anyone forget that.

 

When I see "Best ever" I think of a fighter more times than not,
Being able to defeat any fighter in history at that weight class. Gomez at Bantam, Sanchez at Feather, Duran at light, Pryor at jr.welter, R.Robinson at welter, T.Hearns, Jr.Middle, Hagler, at Middle, Foster, Moore, Spinks , Lt Heavy and at Heavyweight,,,,,,,,, Ali. Ali proved the most against the best fighters, big punchers check, Shavers,Foreman,Lyle,Liston,Williams. Clever boxers, check Patterson,Jones, Terrell, Ellis, Young,Mathis. Swarmers/pressure fighters Frazier, Bonevea, awkward fighters like Norton.

Also when Ali came into his prime, he possibly didn't loose a round between 1965 until 68 when he was forced to resign. He fought 9 times during that period and simply dominated ever fighter in front of him. ( Unlike a Mayweather Jr who fought 9 times between 09-2015, or Wilder who averages 2 fights a year.) Ali simply was on the the top of Mt.Everest while his opponents were at sea level when he was prime.

Let's look at some of the contenders for "Best ever". J.Johnson, not enough film to really give a realistic opinion, but of what little film of him out there,he really doesn't look impressive.
Dempsey, beaten by Middleweights in his prime, refused to or wasn't
Allowed to fight black challengers, a question can be asked is was he
The best of his own era?
Joe Louis, possibly, no check that, was the greatest offensive heavyweight in history. His arsenal was the best in Heavyweight history, his combination of speed,technique, power wasn't seen before,and hasn't been seen since.
But he was KO'ed in the prime of his career, dropped multiple times, by fighters that really wasn't that special. And a natural Lt.heavy boxed circles around him until he got stupid.
Marciano tough as nails,possibility the toughest and most determined heavy in history, but let's be real , he came along at the right time.
Holmes, great fighter but athletically wasn't great, not one win against a
Fighter considered ATG. He possibly could've beaten many ATG's but their were none when he came on the scene.
Tyson, the 2nd best offensive fighter in history, but unlike Louis with great feet in his prime. Dominated his era, but as was proven in the late stages of his career, was mentally weak, and if he fought a fighter like Liston or Foreman prime vs prime, would he have been able to deal with a bigger,meaner bully? By his history probably not.
Lewis big,strong, great puncher, smart fighter, but was KO'ed twice in his prime by fighters that were not special. Enough said.
The Klichkoes brothers, right place right time but are just bigger better athletes than the fighters they faced. And the competition they faced leave
A lot to be desired.
Same with Wilder,Joshua and Fury, Wilder. The last five fighters fight like
Robots, and two of them ( Wilder and Joshua) look down right amateurish at times.
Ali faced and defeated 3 fighters in almost anyone's who know anything
About boxing top ten heavyweights in history. He went 5-1 against them. How many others can say the same. Hell how many can even say they faced 1 ATG?
Once we get past his great ring exploits , we see his impact in the world, Ali helped change a country. And helped stop a misguided war. He is more recognized in the world than any fighter, check that athelet in history. Ali was as he said "The Greatest of All times". At least in the Heavyweight division.

 

I already agreed in terms of sheer quantity over quality Louis has just about everyone beat. Stopping those ex champions with little experience is indeed impressive. But the fact you dodged the question is why Ali is in the conversation for being #1, he has the beat signature wins.

 

No one equals The Greatest Muhammad Ali. Especially when you think we were deprived of him for nearly FOUR YEARS!! of his prime for purely political reasons. Just imagine what he would have done in those four years

 

The question of whose the greatest has layers to it. I voted Joe Louis partially because of his accomplishments in the ring but also for what he did outside of it and the implications he knew were associated with it. He was one of the greatest men In a age of great men.

If I was to vote purely on what they did in the ring I'd vote Ali. he is the greatest in the sense that he has the greatest record. I dont think any ATG defeated as many other ATGs as Mohammed Ali did which is about as impressive of a achievement as you can get as a fighter, he also really breathed alot of life into the sport, the same way Dempsey and Tyson have.

 

Why would you say I dodged the question when I answered it in the first sentence? I also didnt knock Ali. Maybe that is coming from somewhere else. My point was/is that Joe Louis made the Heavyweight Championship what it is or what it once was. He is still the standard of what the Heavyweight Champion is. The dominance over such a long period of time, the consistency, the dedication it took. He ducked nobody, granted rematches when necessary, defended his belt on a regular basis.
As far as his skills are concerned he is still perhaps the perfect puncher boxing has had. Combinations short and precise. Quick hands to go with excellent boxing IQ.

 

The question was which signature win of Joe Louis is better than Ali's signature win over Foreman. Im still waiting.

Im not denying Louis is possibly #1 in terms of skill. I even said so in my own post. The #1 hw has to have the best wins too.

 

I think asking who 'The Best' ever Heavyweight is, is quite a different question to who is 'The Greatest'. The Best I've ever seen is Lennox Lewis, followed closely by Mike Tyson. The Greatest however, well that's a toss up between Ali and Louis. I think in his day Lennox Lewis beats every Heavyweight that's ever lived.

 

The problem with this idea is how, in his day, Lewis was knocked cold not once but TWICE by mediocre fighters. That never happened to Holmes, Ali, Bowe, Holyfield, Marciano, Foreman, Frazier, Liston....

Getting knocked out twice by mediocre fighters (in one's prime, no less) just doesn't bode well as Best/Greatest of All Time.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong. No disrespect meant (I have Lewis above Foreman as #5 ATG).

 

I totally get what you're saying but, just as an aside, I would have a prime Lewis demolishing every current, active heavyweight with relative ease. Yes, he may suffer the odd shock defeat, as in real life but, he would very likely go on to avenge those losses in likely devastating or dominating fashion.

Every Heavyweight that's ever lived has had an off night, its how they rebound back from them that matters.

 

Oh sure, I agree he'd beat anyone out there today (though Wilder might get that shot in and eeek!).

I don't know, Lewis became quite the boxer with Steward. If Fury outboxed Wilder, Lewis would have dominated him.

Lewis would have done pretty darn good today, I'd say.

 

That's an extremely one sided view GCC and nothing like your normally well thought out mainstream posts.

 

Im honestly playing devil's advocate to fuel the debate. Holyfield vs Lennox is a very interesting discussion in terms of resume.

 

Fair enough. Glad i didn't go into a 600 word ****ing diatribe!!!

 

The guy that would be all the others.