Donovan ruddock v George foreman 1991 who wins ?

it's a fact Smith was a last minute replacement. It's a fact Witherspoon attempted to pull out and Don King forced his fighter to take the fight and threatened legal action. It's a fact witherspoon was dealing with financial problems and living in a scrappy apartment. Are those calid excuses for not doing your best? Maybe, maybe not. But the evidence shows his head clearly wasn't in the game.

Smith himself admits witherspoon's mind wasn't on the fight:

"I knew his mind couldn't be on the fight. He wasn't thinking about me. My plan was to be all over him. He embarrassed me the last time and I wanted to pay him back. I did." - James "Bonecrusher" Smith

It seems like you are just sticking to a narrative.

Either way, this unmotivated version of witherspoon was certainly not equal to an undefeated prime lineal champion. You believing he'd beat moore is speculation and irrelevant to the conversation.

 

They all had problems with Don King in the 80s. It's a bull**** excuse. Witherspoon got punched in the face.

Now what was the deal with Holyfiled? The shoulder, the supposed heart condition....how he didn't look normal. It's not like he got hit with a bomb ten seconds into the fight and couldn't recover.

 

You guys are running crazy on this topic.

So do you see any 90s Foreman do this to an unmotivated 29y old Witherspoon? Isn´t this the question to ask, if Foreman could apply any kind of power Ruddock took from a hard hitting James Smith?
I´ve my problems with Foreman even beating that Witherspoon to be honest.

And as I told in another thread, I think many overrate 90s Foreman H2H due to a single landed right hand on a questionary chin in 94, ending a fight he was absolutely not winning (again) against this level of opponent. And Ruddock imho was on the level of Morrison and Moorer, above Alex Stewart.

This fight would go the distance imho with Foreman not liking what he´d have to take, while Ruddock got up against Tyson 2x, Morrison, and Smith going on.

 

Lol we're not about to play this game where one fighters excuse is valid and the other's isnt.

If You honestly think Witherspoon of the 2nd Smith fight was equal to or better than champion Moore then im questioning your ability to assess boxing in general. Usually i see you make good points but ive noticed when you have an agenda you will play stupid and stick to a very narrow view of things.

 

The last part of your post is false. He did not "get up and go on" against morrison hr was stopped. Tyson stopped him in the 1st fight. Smith was the only instance of Ruddock getting off the floor to win.

90's foreman was never on the floor to begin with. He was also much more offense oriented than Smith, had a way better jab, and was a better body puncher. A guy like Ruddock who leaves himself open and didn't have the best balance or stamina getting repeatedly out jabbed, pushed back, and nailed in the body by a guy who hits as hard as foreman will be in horrible shape and breathing hard by round 6 if he doesn't manage to turn things around.

Btw people disagreeing with you doesn't mean theyre "crazy". It's condescending and tells me you likely won't budge on anything which depletes my incentive to engage.

 

Start the thread then like I previously suggested.

Holyfield at least had a verifiable shoulder injury and measured heart issue, although it isn’t clear if the heart problem was present during the fight and significant. It’s that v. Witherspoon’s feelings even though Witherspoon got tagged big at the opening bell.

 

Ruddock got hit way too much to handle Foreman. The way to beat George is movement...staying away from his power. Morrison and Young were prime examples of that.

Ruddock never fought anything like that. He got hit a LOT and partly because he was always trying to get his own shots in. Foreman never once went down in his comeback fights, including against guys with BIG left hooks like Cooper and Morrison. Never once. Unlikely Ruddock could have done it...I doubt 90s Tyson could have done it (though I give the prime Mike more than a good chance against the just-returning Foreman of the 80s).

I can see some of the validity in some of what No Neck is asserting, but overall I think he might be taking some of this personally. No offense, No Neck. This is all just conjecture.

 

I see posters denigrating Smith. But I don’t see any reason why a Ruddock fight with Foreman would be much different.

 

You said in ALL of those fights they fought George in the pocket and used little movement. That is about as disingenuous as you can get. As I said, you either didn't watch those fights, or have no clue what you're looking at. Nobody said they danced around like Ali, but YOU DID disagree with my notion that they used caution and some movement, and instead claimed they all stood in the pocket trading with George.

 

No one is denigrating Smith, it's just that some posters are dealing with the facts a lot better than some others are.
Foreman was in a superior class to Smith. It's not that difficult to wrap one's head around.

 

I literally just said I'm not about to compare excuses.

Don King being a ***** to his own boxer and switching the opponents is also verifiable.

The fact Tim got tagged early by a guy he previously schooled isn't 100% proof but it does raise an eyebrow.

 

And George mysteriously never rematched Moorer.

 

And Ruddock was knocked mo

And Ruddock was mysteriously knocked by Jaco whom Foreman knocked in less time than even Tyson!

 

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By the way, comepare this with Ruddock of Tyson 1/2 highlights, both guys in there are very slow and past it.

Ruddock DID get up from a vicious hook on the temple! He got wobbled some times too and always continued, even when the ref stopped in round premature second into round 7.
Tyson 1: Ruddock was knocked down in the 2nd. Stopped premature another time. leading to a rematch.
Tyson 2: Ruddock down in 2nd and 3rd rounds.
Smith: Ruddock was knocked down in the 2nd.

If thats "no case for a boxer getting up" fighting punchers, I don´t know what else to say.

You are right, Foreman was bullet proof. The chances of Ruddock putting him down are not high. But the chances of Foreman, who needed 32 rounds to stop a Stewart/Morrison/Moorer level fighter doesn´t have high chances to stop a fellow who got up that often either. I said it earlier, a decision for either one is the highest chance outcome. Thats pretty logic, isn´t it?
The Stewart fight was close. He lost to Morrison, who Ruddock at least put down also. He arguably didn´t win any round against Moorer either until that landed punch. His scorecards against Holyfield were worse than Larry Holmes.
Btw, a 39y old Smith went the distance with prime Moorer too, without going down. The guys aging Foreman clearly beat were Cooney and Lakusta, the first of them not giving Michael Spinks any credit for having drug problems, three years earlier! Regarding Smith - Witherspoon, you were d'accord with me too that GF would prob. not beat that Witherspoon either, no?
You can make a UD case for anyone here, but maing Foreman a household favorite in there is just drastically absurd.

You know I respect you as a poster, but this is pretty twisted: Prob. no one in this thread is as biased as you towards George Foreman (as you are very pro GF in general), but a boxer like Ruddock (who is no ATG) got fellows on here for an agenda? This is just skewed.

 

Now where does this come from??

David Jaco, far behind on points, was declared the winner when Donovan "Razor" Ruddock failed to answer the bell for the eighth round.

"I had an asthma attack during the fight," Ruddock said later. "I started hyper-ventilating and the doctor stopped the fight." Others, including Jaco, said Ruddock quit. [1]

"The day before the Jaco fight, Donovan was sick," said Delroy Ruddock, the boxer's brother and manager. "A doctor examined him and told him not to go ahead with the fight. But Donovan hadn't had a bout in, like, six months. His attitude was: 'I'll take a chance. The fight won't go the distance.' " [2]

In a 1999 interview with Cyber Boxing Zone, Ruddock said he started taking the asthma medication Ventolin when he fought. He also stated: "I moved to Florida for the nice weather, and it's helped me quite a bit. I haven't had a problem with it since. I also had some serious large tonsils that were blocking my airway that I've had removed." [3]

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