Fury PED Controversies

Mitigated by the fact that they were stiff sitting ducks like Wach and Pulev. Nobody could ever mistake Tyson for a Wach or a Pulev.

Wlad was very dedicated and well preserved, a reigning champion who was being compared to a fine wine a year prior to meeting Fury (having gotten rid of Pulev inside 5). The most one can really say is that he had some stylistic issues with a brave and resourceful Bryant Jennings, while winning about eight rounds of that fight to earn a clear margin of victory. He showed that he was physically still very capable of pulling the trigger vs. AJ. A tentative approach is a trademark of his 2006-2015 career, varying in degrees dependant on who he was facing.

And Fury is still getting better.

 

Who are “the Furies”?? Aren’t those people who have a kink for folks dressed up as large bunnies and whatnot??

 

Austin,Thompson, Mccline, Bostice, Jefferson as well were tall and he stopped all of them. Fighters get old overnight, He showed he had slowed down significantly when fighting Jennings while he was age 39 Fury faced Wlad well after his prime and yes he gave a spirited effort against Joshua but anybody with half a brain could see his left hook which was one of his best punches was slower compared to his prime and quite a few of them probably would of ended the fight.

Just like when Ali fought 4 times after age 36 and lost 3 fighters get old and drop off pretty fast.

BTW nobody is well preserved after 67 pro heavyweight fights and 170 amateur fights that is a lot of training camps with wear and tear.

 

And none of those were a Fury, or even a Joshua (maybe you can argue McCline as being somewhat near Anthony's ballpark).

It's just too convenient an excuse for losses that came along around the same time that quality men with size showed up. You can cite the bit of trouble he had with Jennings (attributable more to stylistic/strategic factors by my estimation; Bryant was very strong and athletic, and cute and bold with it, hustling Wlad in a way that forced him away from his strengths, though the big man still deserved a clear verdict), but Wlad was basking in the praise for his dynamic KO5 of Pulev just a few months earlier.

His hook was fast enough when he fought Fury (and was the subject of much acclaim just a year prior vs. Pulev), although he took a while to let it go. And the Fury fight is the one I'm primarily concerned with. More on that further down the post.

Ali had fought a who's who of two strong eras, tended to focus on the absorption of punishment in sparring and was misusing medication on top of it. Never mind the last four, watch him vs. Norton III or Shavers, he's already become a shell of himself (and still miraculously bangs it out with Shavers in the 12th). There's no way the version that fought Spinks X2, Holmes and Berbick is comparable to the state of preservation Wlad was in. Ali absolutely did not age overnight.

Hopkins went into his late 40's with very similar practices employed by Wlad. Granted, the final "Alien" incarnation of Hopkins had to use all his wiles to stay competitive, but he was capable at 43, which is why fair observers give Joe Calzaghe credit for scrapping out a competitive decision over him (Joe wasn't exactly in his youth, but was in a very fine vein of form and was a good 7 years younger with plenty of stamina still to spare, so it's a rare case of a 36 year old being the spring chicken in a matchup).

Wlad wasn't washed-up by any means at 39, he was physically still very capable, considerably nearer his best than Hopkins was in his 49 y/o twilight when he was still competing at the top. Living the life for years on end and not taking significant amounts of punishment in every bout will allow a guy to go on for longer in something close to his best form.


Wlad lost to Fury because Fury wouldn't let him have his way, Wladimir needs to be set to throw his punches, Fury prohibited it with feint game, head movement and canny footwork. A pattern fighter like Wlad was always going to be bamboozled by that. As I previously observed, his hook was plenty fast in the 12th when he finally sold out and took risks, but he sold out because he knew he only had three minutes left and that his reign was in serious jeopardy. It wasn't an option for Wlad to fight continuously with that kind of endeavor and urgency.

One has to give credit to Joshua, too. Wlad pulled the trigger on him, floored him with his money punch, the ability and the will to resist was there, otherwise Joshua would've had an easier night. Joshua was canny, he pounced on an unsuspecting Wlad at the start of the rounds he caught him in, he used his predilection for the clinch against him in the round he finished him in. There's much more to it than 'Wlad got old'. These men had competitive spirit and abilities unlike those that Wlad had grown accustomed to facing.

 

Give it give two more years, this post Klitschko heavyweight era isn't good.

Fury a drug cheat a liar. I think Joshua beats him if they ever agree to a fight.
Joshua, hopefully doesn't lose again, but if he does pop goes his legacy.
Wilder, a glass jawed excuse making type who never beat a top 10 contender in his prime.

There you have it, the cream of the crop post Wlad.

 

hrgovic is post wlad m8

 

I highly doubt any of them want him.

By the time Hrgovic gets a title shot, Fury will either be banned for PED's or retired, Wilder will have suffered his 2nd KO loss, and not even his best fans will back him, and Joshua, I hope will still be around.

 

fury beats hrgovic right now. and id favour joshua.

 

The difference between beef and boar is night and day. Boar can hold 10x the amount of PED's than Mexican beef. Fury knew this. That's why he went with boar. Smart guys. Add in the jacked up gloves and poor ol Wilder didn't stand a chance.

 

Well, someone should have reminded me that Ali-Shavers was a 15 round fight by now.

 

Ali-Shavers was a 15 round fight.

 

1. Hopkins was most likely a steroid cheat in his career since he refused drug testing and didn't decline rapidly like almost every fighter does. vs Pascal and even then still hopkins was not at his best in his latter years just carefully matched.
2. Fighters age and slow down if you cannot understand this most basic fact that athletes in all sports decline by their mid to late 30's due to that most of what you posted is **** and not worth typing a response to.

 

Many people have speculated that K2 were on the gear, too. As we know, the venal state of sport in 2020 means that willingness to submit oneself to an alphabet testing program is not necessarily an indicator of cleanliness. It was Lamont Peterson, after all, who insisted on testing for his aborted rematch with Amir Khan (for which he himself popped dirty, go figure).

Personally, I'm a realist where the issue of PEDs in sports is concerned. I'm also fair-minded as an analyst, so you'll be hard pushed to find an instance of me using the PED issue as an argument against a given fighter, even the ones I have a somewhat dim view of (for example, Dillian Whyte).

I didn't say that he was at his very best (that would be an unreasonable position), I said that he was still capable at an age considerably advanced from Wlad's at the time of boxing Fury/Joshua. And that this is why Calzaghe receives credit for his victory from most fair-minded observers. Likewise, I and many fair-minded others believe that Tyson Fury and Anthony Joshua should receive credit for their victories over a still very capable Wladimir Klitschko (Fury moreso, since Wladimir was both recently active and reigning when they met).

I understand it. What I'm saying is...

...mileage varies. And that is the truth.

There is no need to become ornery or to lay a foul tongue on me, o' correspondent.

You are the fellow, after all, who likened Wladimir's supposed state of deterioration to that of Ali circa Spinks/Holmes/Berbick. I believe that you have far surpassed me in terms of risible (arguably disrespectful) statements.

 

Wladamir had 140 ameture fights and 69 pro fights that is a lot of training camps and fights no one is well preserved after that. hell speaking of Ali he had less fights and was younger and how did he look losing despite being younger.

 

If you believe Wlad was over the hill, we can agree to disagree.


All I'd say is, of all the ways you could've supported your point, Ali is among the least apt examples to cite. As I mentioned, he had fought a who's who of two strong eras, had had a habit of focusing on the absorption of punishment in sparring, was misusing medication and had looked distinctly worse for wear since, well, I mentioned Norton III, but he looked quite badly declined as far back as the Jimmy Young bout. It was primarily his savvy and experience keeping him competitive in his 1976-1978 bouts, because he was physically a shadow of himself.

I defy anyone to actually watch those later Ali showings alongside Wlad's final few performances and sincerely state that they discern equal measures of deterioration in the two men. Wlad 2013-2017 bears a far greater resemblance to his athletic pomp than the 1976-1981 Ali to his (and, just for the sake of this comparison, I'm imagining that the pre-exile Ali never existed and that the Ali who fought Frazier was the man at the height of his athletic ability). Ring age and numeric age are two different things. Pacheco left after the Shavers bout for good reason, he'd seen enough; his love for Ali kept him in the champion's camp against his better judgement after Frazier III (while pleading with him to retire), but he couldn't conscionably continue to support the continuation of his boxing career after what he saw in '76 and '77.