Tyson was on another level compared to Wilder, Fury and Joshua

Deontay Wilder is heavily flawed. If you’ve watched his career unfold, you’d know that.

Height can be important depending on who you’re fighting, and how your styles match up.

Again, Wilder’s size would have left him at a disadvantage against a guy like Mike.

Yes, his shorter opponents all got knocked out. But they were lesser fighters than Ortiz and Fury.

During Tyson’s career, every guy he fought had size advantages over him.

Tyson Fury isn’t the best HW today due to being the tallest guy. It’s because he’s got the best overall skills.

Surely you can see that.

Are you familiar with Nikolai Valuev?

Did you watch his career play out?

Are you saying that Wilder can’t be beaten by smaller HW’s?

Plenty of smaller HW’s would have been more than capable of beating Deontay Wilder.

Evander Holyfield - 6’2

Larry Holmes - 6’3

Ray Mercer - 6’1

Chris Byrd - 6’2

All those guys would have had a very good chance of beating him.

Today, Dillian Whyte and Andy Ruiz would have a good chance of beating him.

Stating that Tyson is today’s best HW based on height and weight is completely ignorant.

 

Bro it is time to pull the ultimate destruction argument, you brought it by yourself.
Nikolai valuev ladies and gentleman.

nikolai valuev started boxing at age 21. the guy has the coordinative skills and agility of an ent from lord of the rings. He cannot even put a 3 punch combo together and still... he became world champion, was never beaten by ko and even in those fights with chagaev and haye he managed to win quit a few rounds.
If the guy had tried to become a tennis player at age 20 he would have failed miserable, same goes for soccer, for basketball, for football, volleyball but in one sport he could still become one of the best in the world: boxing.
Because physique, weight and bodymass are just so crucial that they can easily overcome any other attribute.

 

Okay.

I respect your opinion and your honesty. But earlier, you said that today’s HW’s were the best HW’s of all time.

Well how can they be?

 

The modern HW’s aren’t better.

Better at what?

Bigger? Yes.

Better? No.

Deontay Wilder wouldn’t have had a chance of beating Mike Tyson.

Can you not appreciate how their styles would have meshed?

Can you not understand how difficult it would have been for Wilder to have landed flush on a 5’10 guy, who was crouched with a bob and weave style?

Think about it for a second.

He would have had no time or opportunity to have landed his huge right hand.

Mike would have gotten inside of him easily.

It would have been a horrible stylistic match up for him. Horrible. Again, his great size would actually have worked against him and put him at a disadvantage.

After a quick search, I’ve just found this:

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...-fury-prime/&usg=AOvVaw1umx973aG1UGrulzHN4bdn

 

You’ve tied yourself up in knots.

So:

Valuev was beaten by smaller guys who were more skilful, as size alone isn’t enough to rule at the top.

Which is the exact reason smaller guys could beat Deontay Wilder.

Again, Tyson Fury isn’t the best HW today just because he’s the tallest and the heaviest.

Yes, those are advantages that he has, but he’s the best because he has the best skill set.

He has the best footwork.

He has the best reflexes.

He has the best technique.

You said earlier that if he’d been 6’3 instead of 6’6, he’d have been knocked out by both Wilder and Wladamir.

I just can’t understand where that level of thinking comes from.

 

Again, HOW are they better?

How?

You have just said that Joshua sucks.

Joshua has beaten:

Whyte
Parker
Povetkin
Ruiz

So if Joshua sucks, by your own logic, those guys who he beat must also suck.

So that leaves you with Wilder and Fury.

Wilder has just been embarrassed because he’s nothing without his power.

That leaves Fury.

So how can today’s HW’s be better?

You are tying yourself up in knots by making ridiculous statements.

 

That's ok, neither would Fury, Joshua, or Ruiz.

 

Apparently, today’s guys are the best fighters of all time.

 

This content is protected

I know this one, no idea what his current take on that is he might change it.

The thing is at this point nobody got easy into wilder. The only guys who could really trouble him were 6‘3 ortiz who outjabbed him and fury who is taller then him.
There was not a single fight that suggested that wilder would have had a problem with a extrem short guy that would bob and weave.
Even molina and duhaupas are over 6‘3.

wilder can counter punch and he can catch you coming in. He showed that against szpilka and ortiz.

 

Look, if you’ve watched Wilder’s career and you’ve watched Mike’s career, it’s one of the easiest fantasy fights to predict.

You don’t need to be Columbo to work out what would have happened.

EVERY fight Wilder has ever had shows you the issues he’d have had with a prime Mike Tyson.

He wouldn’t have been able to have stopped Mike’s onslaught.

Mike would have rushed him and just unloaded hooks to the body.

He’d have hit him with rapid fire combinations, and Wilder would have had no opportunity to have landed his own power shots.

You have got an unhealthy obsession with size.

Skills will always be more important than size.

Wilder is dangerous because of his huge power and his unpredictability.

In terms of ability, he’s very flawed.

We’ve seen him throw wild shots with no technique, whilst been completely off balance.

We both know how he’s acquired his nickname.

Tell me how you think he could have stopped Mike from getting inside.

 

what is hard to understand about that:

a completely uncoordinated guy with absolut 0 talent, or strategical understanding slow hands and not even a massive punch, starting at age 20 was able to become a heavyweight champion had a couple of good wins and was defeated in a competive fight against 2 guys that practice the sport from a super young age are very athletic and have 100 of amateur fights.

If he would have tried the same thing in basketball, volleyball or football he would have never made a living of that let alone beeing a world champ.

its just cause of his shire size and the benefits you get from it in hw boxing.

The taller you are the more distance you have to your opponent and the longer you can set your range up. In lower weights height usally means that you are lankier and thinner then youre opponent so therefor you give away a strength aspect. No in hw you can be taller and bigger. And then you can abuse your lead hand and consitanly hold it into your opponents face which all they all do no matter if lewis, klit, fury, holmes also including ali.
Now when the other guy is taller and bigger then you and you 2 somehow operate on the same skill level you will have a hell lf a problem to pull that of.
Perfect example fury vs wlad. Or lewis vs vitaly or wilder vs fury.
Of course from time to time a smaller man is going to be successful but on in the long run hw has now always been dominated by a man who was big and then followed and era with a guy even bigger.

Holmes-tyson-lewis-klits-fury and as mentioned tysons reign was short

 

ok so my take on joshua record feel free to disagree:

povetkin way to old, looked horrible against that ridenko guy 1 yer prior

Whyte is way better now then when he faced joshua, but yeah that wach performance was dreadful

Ruiz i mean yeah ruiz is the proof that aj sucks just look at him.

parker also horrible to me

yeah they all suck.

the good ones are fury, wilder and ortiz with ortiz being too old.
The thing is despite what most people here think i am 100 precent certain that wilder kos aj and he would ko anybody of the other ones on that list.

 

I think most people on here underestimate wilder. Everyone called him a glass jaw for 10 years. The fact is that he proofed to be on of the toughest in this division. He got hit clean hard by ortiz and hit on the ear by fury and he didnt quit. Tyson defiantly punches like a horse but at this point i dont know if he has the power to ko wilder. And when tyson gasses after 3 rounds and starts standing he would be a perfect target for wilder right hand.

 

All throughout the thread you’ve said that size is the most important thing. But Valuev proves that that isn’t the case.

Yes, if you had two fighters where one was bigger, but they had the same level of skills and a similar style, the bigger fighter would have an advantage. But other than that, it depends on how they’d match up stylistically.

Valuev was beaten by much smaller fighters. Because his size advantage wasn’t enough to beat smaller fighters who had more ability.

The same applies to Wilder and anyone else.

Mike, Evander, Holmes and Mercer would all be favoured over Wilder.

Today’s HW’s aren’t aren’t the best HW’s of all time just because they’re bigger.

 

I’m very confused.

If Joshua and Ruiz etc suck, and Ortiz is too old, and the only good HW’s are Fury and Wilder, then how the hell can today’s HW’s be the best of all time?

What are you talking about?

You have repeatedly said on both threads that today’s HW’s are the best.

Now you can either retract that statement or you can tell me why.

By looking at today’s best HW’s, you yourself have narrowed it down to only 2 guys:

Tyson Fury

Deontay Wilder

Before his gift draw and his embarrassing loss to Fury, Wilder’s biggest win was Ortiz.

So how is Wilder a GREAT HW?

What has he done for you to class him as being great?

And if you only rate just 2 HW’s of today, then once again, how can today’s HW’s be the best HW’s of all time?

You are all over the place.

You’ve spent all day contradicting yourself and tying yourself in knots.