Was RJJ at 168lbs the most unbeatable fighter ever?

It wasn’t really loaded when he moved up.

Toney had gone.

Eubank had gone.

Benn had gone

Nunn was faded.

Littles had been knocked out.

Liles was there but he wouldn’t fight Roy.

The LHW division had McCallum, Hill, Griffin, Toney and Dariusz.

I think being dominant and looking unbeatable are two completely different things.

Bernard Hopkins had great dominance along with Carlos Monzon.

Yet I’d fancy a lot of fighters to beat those guys.

Although Roy didn’t stay long at the weight, he to me looked unbeatable, as in, I wouldn’t have favoured anybody over him. He barely lost rounds and beat fighters with absolute ease.

 

Tell us how they were available.

 

But he fought guys at LHW who were just as good, if not better than many of the guys at SMW.

There was no habit with the big punchers.

Who were the big punchers?

Jackson, Benn and Gerald.

Who else?

You’ve got to look at the timelines and the politics.

You can’t imply he avoided punchers because he didn’t want to get hurt or knocked out, when he spent most of his career at LHW which was his third weight class. And when he did get knocked out, he jumped straight back in with the same guy, before ending up at CW when he was a shell of the guy he’d once been. So he was hardly risk adverse. He fought Ruiz at HW. Although Ruiz wasn’t the second coming of Ali, he was still a legitimate top 10 HW who’d knocked Evander down.

 

He did duck Steve Collins though.

Maybe his team didn't agree with your sentiments.

 

No.

 

McCallum, Hill and R. Johnson were each 8+ years past their best.

 

In 92 when Jones moved up to super middle, Eubank, Benn, Nunn, Thornton and Littles were still at their best. Not to say they'd of fought the kid.

 

He should've stayed at super middle and made the Collins and Liles fights any way he could. A fat old McCallum for a vacant belt was a cop out.

 

And an unfancied Griffin made him look silly in all fairness

 

It’s a great debate George.

What about if you swapped their timelines.

If Monzon had fought all of Marvin’s opponents, and vice versa.

What do you think would have happened?

Who had the most ability?

Monzon was awesome, but he looked slow and methodical at times.

Marvin was quicker, he could switch, and he used a bigger arsenal of shots from what I’ve seen.

 

I’m shocked.

Ottke’s probably one of them.

Ha!

 

He didn’t duck Steve Collins at all.

 

You'd be wrong to do that with Monzon.

I think he beats RJJ at 160.

I think RJJ wastes a lot of energy jumping in out of Monzons range, and leaves himself exposed at times to Monzons nasty cross.

I think Roy has the better of the early rounds but gets caught with the right enough that his offense slows down.

I think by the mid to late rounds Monzon starts backing him up and hurting him.

 

Roy didn’t move up to SMW until November, 1994.

Eubank wasn’t still at his brilliant best. He was never the same after the Watson fight. By the time Roy had fought Toney, he’d had 2 controversial decisions against Close, the draw against Benn, and the fight against Schommer where he admitted that he should have lost.

Nunn was still a huge threat due to his style, but he’d recently lost to Little and was not the same guy who’d fought Kalambay and Toney.

Tim Littles had just been knocked out by James Toney.

Tony Thornton was past his best and had recently been beaten by James Toney.

 

Everything was in place to fight Liles until he went back and asked for more money at the last moment.

Mike McCallum was a gateway into a new division.

How was it a cop out exactly?

Montell Griffin and Virgil Hill were very good fighters.

There was nothing special about Collins.

You know yourself that he went life and death with a version of Eubank who was past his best.