ATG: Four Decades later, Who is the Greatest of the Fab 4?

Yea, but Duran is the only fighter to fight all 3 of the other members in their prime. Granted he's 1-4 against them, but worth pointing out.

 

Its a really good answer. My only question is how much weight should be given to Leonard's victory over Hagler.

I think Marvin was hard done to that night.

 

It's funny right, wasn't it the ref, Richard Steele who said, he thought Leonard won but everytime he re- watches the fight it get closer and closer! I kinda feel the same way. I just feel, at that point in time, for both their careers, Hagler should have had a big win , just the fact that it was close, hurt's Hagler, big time, historically. I actually haven't watched it for a few years. Last viewing, I had Ray just edging it. I was a big fan of Ray, when I was a kid though, so I was probably biased. I will have to watch it again, real soon. I also remember it being the ultimate, round stealing fight. Ray did a lot of flashy stuff at the end of a lot of the rounds.

 

I was in a similar position. Big SRL fan, loved how stylish he was and definitely rooted for him over Hagler who had a much scarier and forbidding persona. Though in my defence I was only young.

Watched it again few years after and it looked style over substance. I can't say corruption, but I can say that whilst there's an excuse for a kid getting swayed by a flurry of flashy shots at the end of a round there's absolutely no excuse for a professional judge who is being paid to judge the round in its entirety. Boxrec has SRL 21st p4p and MH 24th. I do wonder how much weight that one fight between them is given and how much it should be given.

That said, I know this isn't the subject we're supposed to be addressing! I still like your order but it's very close between the four of them for me. I also think you could get a different order if you changed the criteria for greatness just slightly. SRL has the technique, TH has the punch power, Duran has the durability and MH has a bit of everything. Truly amazing group of athletes.

 

All Great fighters.

But the Greatest was Duran.

 

For me its

Leonard
Duran
Hagler
Hearns

What a period of boxing.

 

Well put. Hagler was solid as a rock, Duran the wild animal, Ray was the slickster and Tommy the fragile destroyer....lol!

 

1. Duran
His achievements are amazing given his size: probably the best LW of all time, won titles at LW, WW, LMW and MW

2. Hagler
Dominated the MW division, he reigned as the undisputed MW champ for 7 years.
Made 12 title defenses.
Beat all the other 3. Yes, even SRL, a fight in which he was clearly ROBBED.

3. Hearns
Won titles in 5 weight divisions: WW, LMW, MW, SMW, LHW

4. SRL
Was a dirty little ***** who did whatever necessary to win:
- got his ass beat by a smaller man in Duran
- pushed for an immediat rematch cause he knew that after the Montreal fight Duran went on a partying spree and got very fat. Dropping all that weight impacted him bigtime. A true warrior would want to beat the best possible version of his opponent, not the worse one.
- robbed Hagler with the help of the judges. All he did was run all night an tap Hagler's guard
- in their first fight, Hearns was exhausted in the latter rounds, otherwise he was ahead on the score cards.
- again, the judges bailed him out in the rematch, which was clearly won by Hearns.

 

Duran's the P4P greatest of these 4 greats for his reign at lightweight and the way he rose through the weights, the way he challenged the best, the way he went for the best in Leonard at welterweight, the way he beat Leonard in his prime, the challenge to Hagler, the ups and then the downs, the way he beat Barkley at middleweight, the longevity into the 1990's, the charisma. All of it.

 

Definitely Duran.

 

I find this interesting, since it's actually arguable he lost to the other 3 too. Of course, he did lose to Duran, but the Hagler fight and Hearns rematches are very controversial. I've actually seen people argue that Durán did better vs a better version of Hagler.

That's madness! Duran truly was a phenom.

 

These 4 are all genuinely ATG as shown by their resumes and are iconic fighters. There is no doubt that irrespective pf the head to head fights they had and the results that Roberto Duran who started his professional career in the 60's and alongside Ali was the fighter of the 70s is the greatest of them. Ray Charles Leonard otherwise known as Sugar Ray Leonard was the real Golden Child a child of destiny arguably the greatest fighter of all time to some. Boy I hated him as a man because he beat all my heroes. People often talk about his speed, movement and skills to me what I never forget is his championship heart, his killer instinct and that boxing brain the equivalent of great military Generals like Patton. Thomas Hearns oh Tommy from Detroit Michigan. If you look at the history of boxing and invariably when great fighters lost chances are they lost to someone from the Mid West of the United States of America where the best fighters come from. Perhaps the tougher question would be who is the best ever from Michigan where Tommy comes from, also James Toney, Uncle Roger Mayweather and Floyd Mayweather all hail from. I remember Tommy being asked who was the greatest fighter of all time, he thought about it for a while and eventually concluded he must have been and you know what he had a point as well. I don't think anybody else could have done to Duran what Tommy did and you know what I think Duran knew as well but he still marched forward. What men these were and they certainly don't make them like that anymore that's for sure. When it comes to Marvelous Marvin Hagler what can one say? The words honour, integrity, spartan, discipline etc roll off. I remember that he and Hearns were supposed to fight initially in 1983 but was cancelled. I think because of a finger injury Tommy had. Hagler was so incensed because for the type of money on the table for their fight you chop off the pinkie and have the fight. That summed Marvelous Marvin up. He was the complete boxer puncher who went through everyone in the middleweight division in the 70s including the Philadelphia guys some of whom outpointed but boy he got his revenge. Such a dignified warrior. Duran, Hearns and Hagler are 3 of my personal heroes. Leonard I disliked but ultimate respect for as a fighter. Like I said if I had to choose one as the greatest of the 4 all things considered including historical perspective the Lightweight Roberto Duran Manos de Piedra Hands of Stone is my pick. He hated Americans with a passion back then as symbolised by Olypic Gold Medalist SRL but the fantastic thing about boxing is SRL and Duran are friends today as are Tommy and SRL. I understand why Marvin is not friends with SRL though.

 

Duran>>>>Hagler>>>>>Hearns>>>Leonard.

Duran is likely the greatest LW ever. Period. I don't hold the losses against Hagler or Hearns against him. The Leonard loss hits hard. Hagler is one of the top 3 MWs ever. Leonard was post prime in their fight but so was Hagler and people always ignore this. Hagler's war with Hearns (division aside, Hearns was much bigger than Hagler) is the difference maker in their order in my opinion. Hearns in my opinion is a top 5 WW ever and one of the most complete fighters ever. I will go to my deathbed saying Hearns is better than Leonard and could be 2-0 against Leonard given different circumstances. Leonard was phenomenal but the other 3 did more, and shined longer.

I don't feel I'm being biased as 3 of these men are my all time faves and I rack by brain over their order often.

 

I think Hagler is the worst. He's pretty overrated. Still obviously an ATG.

 

Really? If anything I think he's underrated by many.

He certainly belongs in the conversation.

Also have to say this could be one of the hardest ones to call in all of boxing. As I've read different posts I've found myself being swayed different ways.