1952 Rocky Marciano vs 1960 Cleveland Williams

Oh sorry I forgot everyone who doesn't favor over every man who ever lived and worships him at an alter is a hater.

 

So was Rocky Marciano.

So he was a spirited loser. Great. You know what the best spirited loser is? A loser.

A fighter who gets a lot if respect but never beats anyone. We will call him the Bert Cooper of his day, then. But let's not pretend that he was going to beat Rocky Marciano, because he was not in that league.

I can only keep repeating the obvious: all of these acolytes did not translate into actual wins. So you can type out the "riiiight" with all the extra letters, but at the end of the day, Williams is still just a spirited loser with one decent win in 93 fights.

 

that's what I think

 

I actually have a Rocky Marciano shrine in my room that I burn incense to every night.

 

psycho

 

I also am the founder of the Church of Rocky Marciano. Come join my congregation. @mcvey is already a member.

 

no thanks, I attend the church of Emile Griffith. lol

 

For some reason, I didn't get a notification for this hence my late reply. One decent win? He defeated Billy Daniels (twice) Roger Rischer, D i c k Richardson and Alex Miteff. All ranked at the time he beat them.
"Cleveland (Big Cat) Williams, who shattered the title hopes of 7th ranked Alex Miteff with a 5th round TKO, set up a howl today for a shot at champion Floyd Patterson. If Williams ever looked as though he deserved a shot at the title, it was Tuesday night. He took command of the fight from Miteff from the start, opened a bad cut over his left eye in the 2nd, floored him for eight counts in the 3rd and 4th, and was beating him badly when referee Ernie Taylor mercifully ended it 1:32 deep into the 5th."

He also was the only person to knock out Terrell anywhere close to his prime and then held him to a split decision in his peak which many including the AP thought he won.

He also had solid wins wins over the following men Wayne Bethea, John Holman, Omelio Agramonte, Frankie Daniels, Alonzo Johnson, Terry Daniels, Roberto Davila, Billy Daniels, Bob Albright, Tod Herring, "Young" Jack Johnson, Curly Lee Chapman, and Sonny Banks

The Alonzo Johnson win in particular was very impressive. Alonzo Johnson, a formerly ranked contender had gone the distance with Ali, Miteff (2X), Machen, Mildenberger and Folley, had wins over Valdez and Daniels, had never been stopped when he signed to meet Williams. Here was the result:

"Cleveland (Big Cat) Williams, who did to Alonzo Johnson what 29 other opponents couldn't do, said today he wants to fight 2nd ranked heavyweight Eddie Machen next. Johnson, 195, stepped into the ring last night without having been knocked out in his previous 29 fights. Williams, 210, took just two minutes and twenty six seconds to wipe that away. Johnson never landed a blow. Williams put him away with a flashing left hook." -United Press International

Herb Goldman ranked Williams #22 All-Time Heavyweight source: http://m-baer.narod.ru/top/goldmane.htm

The ring (panel of experts, former fighters and managers and people who've been around the game):
rated him as one of the best fighters who never won the title and rated him #31 (From the 1999 Holiday edition)

Rated him #49 in a list of greatest punchers of all time encompassing all divisions Source: https://boxrec.com/media/index.php/The_100_Greatest_Punchers_of_All-Time!




He also held the highest ranking heavyweight not named Sonny Liston, to a majority draw in which the majority of the crowd, the AP, as well as the 3rd judge had him a clear winner. Machen also remarked he was harder to fight than Liston. "In a way he's tougher to fight than Liston because he has the speed the other doesn't have. You can't walk around Cleveland like you can Liston." -Eddie Machen Source: https://boxrec.com/media/index.php/Cleveland_Williams_vs._Eddie_Machen Not bad for a guy who's "largely a myth".

I've provided testimonies from numerous opponents who all had good things to say about Williams as well as well respected boxing Publishers such as the RING. I could publish many more but I feel that I've more than proven my point. The idea that all EIGHT of those fighters as well as all these experts and historians are mistaken, and an armchair warrior such as yourself knows better is absurd.

 

Wow! I think the reason people say Williams only had one good win is because Terrell was on a level above all of Cleve's other good wins. Many just don't understand that guys like John Holman, Alex Miteff, Wayne Bethea, Dick Richardson, and Billy Daniels were not bad fighters in their time. They all registered big wins and gave some fine losing efforts.

 

I had actually considered posting something like this in the future. With Williams though, it does seem like people like to brush off FACTS as myths. Every big name that faced Williams had nothing but respect for his abilities, and it was often clear to see in the fights. Good thinking with the Alonzo Johnson comparison. The same thing could be done with say-Alex Miteff, a guy who beat Nino Valdes. And for fans of Chuvalo, Folley, and Machen (who are still very great), Chuvalo struggled with Miteff, and Folley and Machen couldn't knock him out either, and these guys were in their primes. Williams stopped him in 5.

 

Rocky by KO round 4-7!

 

Marciano and Williams fought Keene Simmons!Prime Keene Simmons was KOd by Marciano and while he was past prime went distance with Williams!
Marciano was better than prime Simmons who would beat Williams!Also Keene stated Marciano hit alot harder!

A green Terrell and he did not knocked him Ernie was stopped on his feet!He beat Williams second time they meet!
While LHW Bob Foster knocked prime Terrell in 7 rounds!

No one of them is really good fighter except Wayne and Sonny Banks!
Wayne was beaten easy by Liston and ancient Valdes!
Sonny Banks was knocked by two light punchers in 4 rounds called Clay and Young Jack Johnson!
Alonzo was knocked by Machen and Pastrano much easier also!

Was he ranked by any good historian and what this you post mean?He still did not beat anybody good!
He was knocked by LHW Bob Satterfield!
Marciano would knock him easier than Satterfield or Foster because his better chin,power,stamina...

 

I don't completely understand you're writing, but did you say that Bob Foster knocked out Ernie Terrell?

 

Yes he did!

Yes before Terrell wored him down!
In his prime he was knocked many times!
Loss 39–7 Manuel Ramos UD 10 Oct 14, 1967 Estadio Azteca, Mexico City, Mexico
45 Loss 39–6 Thad Spencer UD 12 Aug 5, 1967 Astrodome, Houston, Texas, U.S.
44 Loss 39–5 Muhammad Ali UD 15 Feb 6, 1967 Astrodome, Houston, Texas, U.S.
Did anyone hit only qual hard as Marciano because he was dropped in those bouts?

 

Out of all the guys you mentioned only Spencer floored him. I just watched the Foster fight recently, and Terrell never came close to going down. Ali almost floored him in round 7 and quite a few other times as well, but never knocked him down. And of what we know, there is no proof that Ramos ever knocked him down either. Where did you get these ideas?