1952 Rocky Marciano vs 1960 Cleveland Williams

Moore and Walcott were excellent at countering you though, they had excellent timing and anticipation. Williams wasn't close to them in that, he was just powerful man with decent boxing skills.

 

The mistake here is understanding the levels. When Cleveland Williams knocked a man out it was always impressive. But it is very important to note how highly regarded that man was at the time he was counted out. Graveyard Walters, Candy mcdaniels. Baby booze. Who were These guys? Even Terrell stopped on his feet was not yet a top line fighter. Williams lost the rematch when he was.

When Moore and Walcott knocked out guys, they went down in history decking great fighters or knocking them out. Ezzard Charles was the best heavyweight in the world when Walcott knocked Ezzard clean out with one punch.

Do you know how many times in history that has happened? The best active heavyweight getting knocked clean out like that? With one punch, without being previously hurt in that round?

Archie Moore as a very old man, knocked out a 6’3” heavyweight contender, Alejandro Lavorante The guy was never the same again. Moore stopped some common opponents quicker than Sonny Liston did. In fact, one guy Archie knocked out early went on to knockout the man who beat a young Sonny Liston early in his career.

 

I think this might just be the most ridiculous triangle theory I've ever seen.

 

This is factually incorrect. Williams had earned himself a title shot against Ernie Terrell for the WBA championship, and only missed out because of the shooting. Irrespective to your snide remark, the shooting directly led to the loss of his title shot (which I'm fairly confident he would've won).

 

I'm talking about real world title, he would never beat Ali after Liston and he wouldn't likely beat Patterson before Liston either.

 

Moore couldn't KO the man who was twice obliterated in one round by Liston...

 

I'd make Williams a favorite against Patterson and Ingo. And Patterson is my 5th favorite fighter!

 

Nor Howard King despite five attempts. The same Howard King who was knocked out by Liston in 7 and 3.

 

I don't understand why, Patterson was much better fighter and Williams is no Liston.
Ingemar, I can understand although with Cleveland's questionable chin I wouldn't be so confident.

 

“Moore couldn't KO the man who was twice obliterated in one round by Liston.”

we can all play the at game.

Williams couldn’t KO the man obliterated in one round by Ingo Johansson.

 

Actually Archie Moore knocked out Howard King in a single round. You must have missed that one? Moore was well past his best then. A good seven years after he fought Marciano.

 

Nobody got to Machen the way Ingo did.

 

Williams never got to anyone the way Ingo did either. What unique knockout wins over rated fighters should we start celebrating? I mean, Usually big punchers like Tua and Shavers have some special knockout to hold up like knocking out Ellis early or Ruiz early? On film Williams has zip. Tod Herring is as good as it gets.

 

I'm not that high on Williams either tbh, I was just responding to that logical somersault about old Archie KO'ing someone who KO'd someone who beat a young Liston, as if that proves anything at all.

 

I agree. Patterson was much better than Williams.

Patterson beat #1 contender Tommy Hurricane Jackson after Jackson forged a better record than Williams ever put together. Jackson had wins over buys like Layne, Bucceroni, Clarance Henry, Ezzard freakin’ Charles And Bob Baker to earn his shot at Patterson. Williams never did anything like that. or ever could.