Jesus christ pbf was trying to sell a fight and hype up cotto. No one with an ounce of common sense would consider cotto undefeated.
The "if you go by fairness" in my response is the key here, due to the nature of the thread. I consider Castillo 1 a loss if you go by what really happened in the ring. On paper Floyd is undefeated, like Tyson Fury is (bull too), Callum Smith is (bull) etc...
OK but for Floyd to say that and for us now to conisder what he said ridiculous how can we take anything that Floyd says or does seriously? We have to then consider that Floyd will say anything to hype a fight, or even say things that aren't true. Like when he tried to spin the catchweight as Canelo asking for the catchweight based on an interview he did years earlier when Canelo was asked about fighting Mayweather at a catchweight. What I'm getting at is we really need to learn from what Mayweather said there to hype up Cotto and be more wary of what he says happened. Like people fell for his BS again and believed him when he made it seem like the catchweight was Canelo's idea when pressed on why there was a catchweight after what he said about Cotto being drained vs Pac. This is spin from Mayweather and it suggests that he's manipulative and that he used underhanded tactics which gave him advantages that led to victories. I'm not trying to drive a wedge between Mayweather fans who rate his performance vs Canelo highly and don't want to use his own logic to this match, but at the same time we should at least hold Mayweather to the same standards that he held Pacquiao to, even if he tried to hype up Cotto, he still said it, and when he said it, it was taken as a legitimate point that many did not speak out against.
That's an astute observation. If one opens up the Pandora's Box of losses that should have been wins, you have to then accept views on wins that should have been losses. Good to see the OP is so open-minded about this....
I've always been open minded to it. Many claim that GGG deserved to win the first match, while I disagree with that I still am open-minded to it, so much so that I always tried to have detailed debates about who won certain rounds and such to get to the bottom of that. I'm simply saying "look if you want to argue that Canelo should have several losses, then you should at the very least be open-minded to the argument that he also could be still considered undefeated". The problem though as you can see is that people want to have their cake and eat it to. Many people only seem to be open-minded to one side but not the other, open to the idea that Canelo that should have more losses, but not to the argument that he should have less. The argument that he should still be considered undefeated is a legit argument, and it should be respected at least to the level that arguments that he should have more losses are.
You can consider it a loss but it wasn't he won a close fight and in the rematch when healthy beat jlc clearly. In reality he's 2-0 against jlc. I thought charlo beat Harrison in their first fight but he's not undefeated he has 1 loss.
A Canelo nut going against Floyd and his groupies thats refreshing cause they usually are bond due to their hate of Pac and GGG. This should be good
The whole issue with it is that when everything is said and done, what happened on paper is how a fighter is eventually viewed in history. Some say, "It doesn't matter what the result was, everybody saw what really happened in the ring" but that only counts for a couple of months max, or for diehard fans. One of my probably not so popular opinions is that nobody would nowadays consider Ali "the greatest" if all his fights had been judged fairly.
Nah, Canelo is not undefeated, not even if you accept that all his 'decisions' are on the level and the weight loss story. I do agree with Shadow that the weight drain may have significantly affected his performance vs Floyd, however. There's a reason that Alvarez loves draining his own opponents, and that's because he knows how it can put a hole in fight night performance.
Boxers have been saying outlandish things to sell a fight for years. Where have you been? Pbf isnt the only boxer to do this. This isn't new.
The idea that Canelo fans and Floyd fans are on one side and Pac fans and GGG fans are on another is ridiculous. Drawing these kinds of lines in the sand and acting like it's reality is silly. I consider myself a Pac fan more than a Mayweather fan.