Vitali Klitschko vs Evander Holyfield

90% of the top 25 HW's would be just as and in many cases more dominant over Vitali's opposition.

 

Vitali dominated everyone he faced with his jab. Foreman couldn't fight for 3 minutes of a round, neither could Lennox. Vitali could. Vitali throw way more jabs than Lennox and Foreman. Outjabbing someone is about using it frequently to control range and using your footwork to keep them at range

I'm a bigger fan of Holyfield than Vitali but I can't see anyway Holyfield can get past the jab. And that's a little unfair as Holyfield was 37 against Lewis but in truth he waited a long time before he got in with Lennox. None of the big name Americans wanted him and in the end we can see why.

 

Let's not ignore the mental side of it. It was just another fight for Lennox Lewis who had accomplished everything in his career. His foot halfway out the door into retirement. On top of his opponent gets switched.
For Vitali it's the biggest moment of his career/life. He was hyped up to prove he belonged in the ring with the great champion. He came out all adrenaline and Lennox had the intensity of a sedated Golden Retriever.
If Vitali was ever gonna beat Lewis it would have been that night.

 

Not a lot of guys fought for all 3mins of a round. Vitali never had to keep up such a pace so its unknown weather he could have or not.

Who he dominated with the jab matters.. Who? Overweight Kirk Johnson? Vitali was never known for being a great jabber. Chris Byrd countered a lot of his jabs with shots to the body.

The simple fact is Holyfield beat better jabbers than Vitali and had the skills , speed and footwork to exploit a lot of Vitali's flaws.

Vitali never battered a guy with jabs like that.. Yeah , Cooney was past it , but so were Vitali's best wins

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The point about Vitali being able to keep up is a good one. It was rare to see him pushed and, whilst Lewis looked exceedingly labored against Vitali (and he often did in fights), VK himself was looking decidedly spent, by the close of the 6th.

If a worn out Lewis could do that against a prime VK then I think those, who were able to stand up to and force the action against Vitali (and several from the prime '90s crop, could have, IMO) they were in with a very good shout, in my book.

Imagine what a prime, charged up version of Lewis (as well as a number of the other ranked fighters from the 90s) would have done to him, in terms of pressure and pace.

 

Vitali dominated Lennox with his jab, who in turn dominated Holyfield with his jab. While Vitali lost, Vitali outjabbed and outworked him for the most part.

Foreman wasn't a good outboxer in his 40s in the 90s. His stamina as an overweight man in his 40s was poor. He had no defense, where as Vitali leaned away from punches and countered them. Foreman went life and death with Alex Stewart and Michael Moorer. Old Holmes and Fat Douglas are the best jabbers Holyfield beat and both couldn't sustain their jab because they were out of shape and unfit

 

You can't compare the rest of the 90s fighters to Lewis, they weren't on the same level. And Vitali was winning the rounds and wasn't as fatigued as Lewis even if Lewis had inflicted more impact damage.

 

there are many issues with your post.First of all, nobody was dominating the Vitali-Lewis match with anything.And the same goes for the Holyfield-Lewis II match.Actually a lot of the press media had Holyfield winning that one.And then, even accepting your argument, the Lewis that fought Holyfield was way sharper than the Lewis that fought Vitali.Add to that Holyfield was not in his prime when he fought Lewis and te thread is about prime Holyfield,Like I said your reasoning is very flawed.

 

I watched and scored Lewis-Holyfield today as a 9-3 fight. Anyone picking Holyfield needs to follow another sport. Holyfield got dominated by the jab for the majority of the fight. Holyfield got shut out in the first 5 rounds. It wasn't remotely close

Lewis was a few years older and heavier against Vitali. But he had issues with stamina in the Holyfield fight, which is the only reason Holyfield won any rounds at all. And Vitali had a higher workrate versus Lewis than Lewis had in the Holyfield fight.

As for Holyfield not being prime. Well he had more stamina than Lennox and he couldn't capitalise on it. If Lennox is a few years younger maybe he can fight at a higher pace too. Vitali certainly can fight at a higher pace than the Holyfield version of Lennox Lewis.

So Holyfield gets way more jabs in his face than against the Lennox. So what's the result? He loses more rounds.

Also if he's 'in his prime', he's also weighing about 20lbs less and is weaker and is more easily bullied

 

I can compare that version of Lewis, with best of the 90s in their prime, and say that a Lewis in that condition would quite probably have been going into matches with them, as the underdog.

Year-for-Year, Lewis looked in better shape than Vitali, by the end of the 6th. But, that's academic.

The point is Lewis was old and tired, but still able to push a prime Vitali to a virtual standstill.

There are other factors to consider as well, but had he been peaking in the 90s, Vitali would have had issues maintaining rank - of that I feel quite sure.

 

I am talking about the second Holyfield - Lewis fight. if you think that one was 9-3 Lewis, you have no clue how to score a fight.Are you saying a Lewis was not properly trained for the biggest fight of his career against Holyfield? Come on.

 

Which 90s fighters compare to even that version of Lennox Lewis? Let's dissect this, Lennox was a special talent. Would Bowe even have got past Vitali's jab? He couldn't get past the inferior Golota's who Lennox lit up in a round.

Lewis's face looked in better shape after 6 rounds but Vitali's cardiovascular system was in way better shape. Lewis was clearly gassed, Vitali is far better conditioned than Lennox.

So sure Lennox deserved the win and it should be stopped for Vitali's health BUT how does Holyfield get past that jab and workrate? I can't see how he can.

And I'm more of a fan than Holyfield than Vitali, I just call it how I see it

 

He must have shrunk ,he once told me he was 6'4".

 

No you have no clue how to score a fight. Holyfield did nothing in the first 5 rounds and lost all of them. He was schooled in the first 5 rounds.

If you want to debate this I've broken down the fight in detail in Lewis-Holyfield 2 thread. If you're disengenous I suggest reading my comments and rewatching.

It's either 9-3 or an 8-4 fight. If you score anything else you must be simply not scoring the jab at all which was in Holyfields face all night

I didn't say Lewis didn't train, I said Lewis was gassed, it's obvious watching it.

 

I read your scorecard and it is BS.You only give the very clear rounds to Holyfield.But look I am fine with the official results one win and one draw for Lewis.The judges did a horrible job both time but the end result is fair.

If Lewis was gassed, Holyfield had something to do with it.Those body shots took their toll.And the would hurt Vitali too.