Expert opinions on Marciano VS Liston

There isn’t a person with half a brain whom thought Louis was in control of that fight. Louis May have eaked out a round but there was no doubt about whom was winning and whom would win after the first few rounds

 

He did put up a fight. He didn’t lay down. But I respectfully disagree. I think he was dominated

 

It's not just the Marciano v Liston thing, it's Marciano V Every single heavyweight that ever lived.

There are a handful of people on here who simply cannot bring themselves to admit he may be beaten.
They change the goalposts, accuse others of using PEDS, claim that Rocky would weigh 210-220 in this modern era, claim the likes of Lewis would be much smaller in the 1950's etc.

Basically, they squirm every which way, do anything it takes to avoid publically admitting he was not Superman.

It is a religious cult.

 

I guess Art Henri was Marcianos Bert Whitehurst...

 

There isn't a person with half a brain who thought Rocky won every round either and that includes Louis and Marciano!
The referee and the 2 judges!

• Referee: Ruby Goldstein 2-4
• Judge: Harold Barnes 3-4
• Judge: Joe Agnello 2-5

NB Art Henri wasnt even a third rater18-29-2 He never beat anyone of any consequence.
Bert Whitehurst was a second rater 32-26-6 who did manage to beat
Sid Peaks
Bob Satterfield
Franco Cavicchi

14 of his 26 losses were by
Foster
Moore x2
Johnson x2
Listonx2
De John
Machen
Richardson
Bethea
Davidson
Summerlin
Jackson
Amonti
No comparison.

 

Marciano gets beaten by a lot of champions. And I can name the ones he should not fight. Nobody is invincible.

What I object to is the dismissive way people decide he gets beat with literally no substance to back it up.

For a fighter to beat Marciano he has to have beaten men that beat Marciano. He has to be good enough to beat all the best men Marciano beat. But everyone who thinks he loses tears down the reputation of the men he beat and makes a bigger deal of size than is relevant to the discussion.

Marciano has a 50-50 chance with most champions. He was hard to beat because he retired at his best. In a lot of ways he stole the opportunity we have to concentrate on his shortfalls because he got out before a decline. He's like Jim Jeffries without the Johnson fight. Only Marciano beat better men than Jeffries did. He didn’t do anything wrong. There was no colour bar.

The men who beat all the best fighters Marciano did are Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis, maybe Jack Johnson, maybe Jack Dempsey, Lennox Lewis and Larry Holmes. I have no issue with anyone saying these guys can beat Rocky Marciano because they all did a lot more than Rocky and paid their dues as great fighters.

I think Foreman would be difficult for Marciano. Potentially career ending win or lose..but I certainly don’t think George always beats him at all. And I put Liston and Tyson in that bracket too. But they are just outside of the other champions I named because I don’t think George, mike and Sonny necessarily beat all of the fighters Marciano beat at championship level. For me that takes away any guarantees.

One guy Rocky should not fight is Jack Johnson. I think Johnson really prevents Rocky doing any of what he was good at more effectively than any other fighter.

 

"Love It!!!"...

 

5’7” Albert landed about four Right hands that Sonny didn’t see coming. They just bounced off Liston who literally finished Westphal with the first real punch he landed with, but Imagine Albert was a bit taller and had Marciano's power?

 

Ted Lowry all 5'10" 178lbs of him had Marciano on the verge of a ko.Just imagine if he had been 4 inches taller and 40lbs heavier and could hit like Liston?
"It was Lowry, not Marciano, who was on the verge of scoring an early knockout, stinging Marciano with two terrific rights in the first round and then rocking him with two mighty uppercuts in the second. By the fourth, a staggered Marciano seemed just one punch away from being knocked out. But then, inexplicably, Lowry stopped fighting and retreated into a shell despite warnings from the referee to open up and a cascade of boos from the crowd. To many, it appeared that Lowry was deliberately carrying Marciano. Was foul play afoot? Was Lowry getting paid to lose? Or was he merely tiring? Whatever the reason, a revived Marciano managed to rally in the late rounds even though many of his punches missed their mark or lacked force. On the basis of his aggressiveness and constant punching, Marciano won a unanimous decision from the judges. Most observers felt, however, that Lowry should have won."

Christ this place!

 

"Beautiful !!!".....
"Brilliant !!!"......
"Perfect !!!".....
"Love it !!!".......

Just doing my RockyJim impersonation there.....

I notice he never answered your question.
He never does and I find that cowardly.

 

For every Ted Lowry for Marciano there’s a Johnny Summerlin for Sonny Liston. For every Art Henri there is a Burt Whitehurst. For every Lastarza there’s a Marty Marshall. It’s all swings and roundabouts isn’t it?

 

Rocky shouldn't fight any champ post-Clay... with the exception of Leon... Maybe he could take Bruce Seldon level beltholders.