Why isn't RJJ's victory over James Toney more highly rated

That's how I see it, Jake's only chance is pressure for 10 rounds then win it over the last 5. Roy was always in control of a fights pace so Jake has to take that away . Roy is a 3-1 favorite but it's doable for LaMotta

 

We're losing all contact with reality if we believe that LaMotta has any kind of chance against a healthy, prime Jones. I usually don't like to get involved too much in hypothetical h2hs, but this is just silly to be honest. LaMotta is getting absurdly overrated by some here.

 

Because people are scared of perfection.
Its easier for people to identify with someone if they have a flaw.
Jones victory was tarnished by people saying Toney had weight problems. So now the victory is tarnished in most peoples view. Toney wasn't at his "best".
Then and this is the funny one- Jones was sooo fast that he never got hit and when he finally did get hit he had a GLASS JAW!
Least we forget he fought hundreds of Ameteur bouts never getting knocked out or he sparred THOUSANDS of rounds and never got knocked out.
Or that Hopkins and Toney actually DID connect on Jones and didn't knock him out.

 

I think they're also discounting how a modern middleweight would be so much bigger and stronger in the ring than Lamotta would be. Jones would be 170+ of lean muscle in his middleweight fights. Getting hit clean by a Jones who would weigh 170lb++ in the ring is a whole different prospect to being hit by a 155lb Robinson. I'm sure Jones had more explosive power at middleweight than either Murphy or Nardico who both stopped Lamotta.

 

I think another issue is Toney was better from Cruiserweight upwards. He was inconsistent at Light Heavy losing to Griffin and Drake Thadzi so maybe that's an element to consider. Good win at the time with the hype.

 

The fight was at SMW and he was in form there. He’d just knocked out Tim Littles and Charles Williams.

He was far more consistent at MW and SMW than what he was at the above weights.

 

The 2 Griffin fights are highly controversial.

Many rated Toney P4P no1 before the Jones match up

 

Toney ate himself out of the fight.

dont like how people take credit away from the win,that said Toney looked like he had cement in his boots.

 

Toney looked pretty damn good a scant 4 months before against Charles Williams. I still can’t believe he ate himself into Michelin man proportions knowing he was facing a fighter of Jones ability and credentials immediately afterwards.

RJJ was a freak talent and Toney couldn’t overcome Roys huge edge in speed, movement and ability. It’s pretty simple in my opinion. RJJ was the flat out better fighter and a stylistic nightmare for James anyway. It was a great win and masterclass by Roy and he deserves full credit for it. That Toney went on to achieve some great things after going into the wilderness after this soul crushing loss is a credit to him too. But Roy was better than him pure and simple.

 

Yep him or Pernell Whitaker.

 

Toney was #1 and Jones #2 from memory.

 

I thought it was Whitaker, Toney and Jones in descending order.
Bloody awesome p4p list at that time anyway. 3 generational talents plying their trade at the same time.

 

You could be right Griffo. I've got a mag somewhere leading toward the fight and vaguely remember the order as Toney>Jones. Could be wrong. Pretty sure it was KO mags ratings.

 

I remember having a Ring magazine with the 3 of them on the cover and the gist was Pea and Toney were the top dogs but Jones was closing on them fast.
There was nothing official about the rankings anyway. I cant remember the last time the p4p top two fighters met as Roy and Toney did back then. Just the magnitude of that makes RJJ win even more impressive imo.

 

depended on the the magazine.it was either pernell or James ( the Ring had pernell I think).Roy was at 3