Well you just answered it yourself. Marciano and Dempsey knocked out far better opponents, some of them who were far larger than the light heavy weight sized bums Maher fought. I say this even though I often criticize Marciano's competition but he gets credit for cleaning out his division and stopping nearly every opponent he faced. Maher simply fought longer than most boxers. He lacks the devastating KO's over decent competition. If wilder or Baer or Tua just kept fighting for years against low quality opponents they'd easily pass his record. It's a hell of a lot harder to score as many KO's as Maher when your opponents are over 200 lbs and all have decent amateur backgrounds and technique.
Jimmy Young and Joe Bugner werent durable and skilled??? They certainly have more skill and less stoppage losses than some brawler named o donnel with 6 ko losses. No one stopped Roy Williams aside from Shavers. No one had a prime Holmes in more trouble than when he fought Shavers. If his eyes weren't bleeding profusely he might have been champion. When did Maher ever come close to stopping a boxer as good as a prime Holmes?
But Maher fought plenty of 200+lbs fighters and a some them were top contenders. Goddard, Klondike or O'Donnell were not LHW sized bums. I think that you don't know much about Maher resume to be honest.
Only in Classic would Peter Maher be put forward as belonging with and surpassing guys like Earnie Shavers for power.
Because we have a bunch of evidence of his power on film. And he stopped far better fighters than Maher did. You came up with 3 unconvincing fighters that Maher stopped even though you clearly just researched his entire record thoroughly. C’mon now. Do you think Billy Fox was a huge puncher, too?
Dude, you literally started doing your first actual study of his resume at the beginning of this conversation.
KO percentage doesn't tell the whole story you idiot. Almost everyone who has faced or sparred with both will tell you Wladimir hits way harder. Vitaly mostly used arm punches. Vitaly has a better KO percentage simply cause he was a lot tougher and could withstand punishment, so he wasn't afraid to take risks in order to go for the KO. Wlad was afraid due to his chin.
This I think anyone can agree with. But the fact that he put all his weight behind is punches is the reason many credit him as the hardest puncher. But the fact is if all the HWs would put all their weight behind a punch, there would be at least 20 guys that hit harder. Punching power is determined by speed and mass, and since there are many guys that are far bigger than Shavers, it's common sense they'd hit harder. You also need good technique, but almost all have it at the top level.
WRONG. He was the one who managed to hit them hardest, not the one who had the most punching power. HUGE DIFFERENCE.
So he just so happened to hit Ali, Holmes, Norton, Tills, Caldwell, Bugner, Young, Lyle, Polite and who knows how many others harder than they've ever been hit by chance. OK.
You are right. Power is determined by mass and speed. Theoretically, a heavier man with better technique should be able to hit harder. The thing is not everyone knows how to actually do that. It's a skill and a science, like pitching a baseball or getting full leverage in a judo throw. Shavers intuitively knew how to do it through years of practice. Combine that with his reckless style and confidence and the result is a truly frightening punch. Not everyone knows how to get full leverage and weight into a punch, not even some of the best elite boxers. There's a reason none of Fury, Valuev, or Miller's opponents regarded them as being particularly hard punchers despite having considerable mass. There are other factors at play as well. For example, speed and acceleration. A Very heavy bulky or flabby guy simply won't be able to move their arms with as much speed and snap as a guy with more lean muscle. If Hafthor the mountain learned proper punching technique and trained but kept all his bulky power lifting muscles, he still wouldn't be able to hit even remotely as hard as someone like Wilder. Same thing goes for huge flabby football players or sumo wrestlers. They are simply too slow and stiff to accelerate fast enough to get the most force on their punches. This is exactly what Chuvalo meant when he compared Frazier to a speeding car going 100 mph and Foreman to a truck going 50 mph. The truck has more mass and thus more power, but can't accelerate as quickly. Thus both hurt like hell but the effect and delivery of said power is going to be very different. Lastly, not everyone has the same amount of power. Some people are born heavy handed and just hit harder for some reason. You don't know how many times I've seen guys in the gym and they can be the same height, weight, similar reach, and both trained under the same coach for months yet one hits way harder than the other. Part of it can definitely be attributed to genetics or innate talent. It also has to do with your body type and build. Shorter guys with short arms get more power and rotation speed with hooks and uppercuts due to their low center of gravity and are thus better on the inside. That's why so many of the best left hook and uppercutters at heavyweight were short guys (Frazier, tua, Dempsey, Tyson, etc). Taller guys with long arms and strong backs tend to have more power in straight punches like the jab and the right cross (Wilder, Wladmir, Holmes, Liston, etc). Thus they are better on the outside. Others end up hitting harder due to the type of training you do. For Shavers, not only did he have big hands and natural talent for punching, he spent years doing farm work like chopping wood and lifting bails of hay as well as factory work moving heavy products. Those repetitive motions gave him the fast twitch explosive muscle in his legs and arms to generate power. Looks at Shavers lower body and you'll see how much power is being cooled up there. So long story short, other boxers bigger than Shavers could theoretically hit harder if they used his punching mechanics and put all their weight and leverage into a shot, but it still wouldn't automatically make them hit harder if they lack the acceleration and their bodies aren't the right type.
This is an interesting assertion. I do consider Ken Norton to be both elite (beat Ali twice, kept absolute prime Holmes fighting for his life 15 rounds) and durable (again, the Holmes fight). I'd be interested to find out if I'm mistaken.
Like who exactly? Maher stopped Goddard, Choynski, Slavin and Godfrey. All of them were better than Young. Norton was great, but past his best at this point. Not really, you can research for Maher posts in this forum. I started a few threads about him a year or so ago.
