Ken Norton's Chin

I've seen it.

A 213lb Garcia lands clean on Norton... ...with no effect.

 

Lost all confidence when he lost to Ali.

 

And a 188 lb in shape Garcia brutalized a retreating Norton.

Given you described Garcia as aggressive in the rematch...when he spends most of the fight with his back to the ropes trying to survive.

 

Yes, yes we know... ...Norton was 16-0 and new little to nothing about Garcia. He got caught in the first round and never regained a footing. He was stopped on his feet at the end of the 8th round.

...which is patent nonsense.

As mentioned - Garcia landed hard on this version of Norton with no effect. He wasn't trying to survive on the ropes. He was comfortable there and was, at times, out-punching Norton off the ropes, until Norton found Garcia's body and put him down in the 3rd. Garcia came out in the 4th with a big right hand. Norton ate it and proceeded to push Garcia back again...

You posted the video. Have you watched it?

 

I wouldn't describe a fighter as aggressive when they are fighting negatively off the ropes in spurts and looking to counter. Norton is the bull in this fight, this is exactly where he excelled, and my whole point.

Garcia does hit him hard, he hurts him too, but he doesn't pressure effectively, he either gets muscles back on the ropes or shells back up. Norton is never put on his heels, which is where he typically was stopped.

And Norton usually was stopped on his feet, he was in them when the Foreman fight was waved off too. He was down several times before the stoppage against Garcia.

Regardless my point stands, Norton was capable of being stopped by fighters that aren't necessarily all time great punchers.

 

And yet, Norton was only stopped twice in his prime. One of those times as a relative novice pro; the other of those times, at the fists of George Foreman.

Not a lot of evidence there to support your point, really.

 

Honestly, I dont even think you could tell me my point.

 

Ken got knocked out by punchers that probably make the top 5 heavyweight punchers who ever lived. Not really a lot of shame in that, especially since the last one got him when he was...what, 38? Shavers got him at 37.

He was a great fighter, and I have him #20 ATG. Above Patterson. Yeah, that's what I wrote.

 

But this isn't true. Garcia isnt top 5, he was 188 lbs and while a noted puncher, not highly rated and lighter. Just because it was semi early in his career doesn't mean it didn't happen, and is telling of his inconsistent durability.

 

Norton really grew as a fighter after the Garcia loss and went on a tear. Quite a bit of it was mental. Interestingly Norton was somewhat responsible for Mike Weaver turning over a new leaf almost overnight as he went from being not very serious to quite dedicated.

Norton's problems were as much style as chin. Having said that only two colossal punchers stopped him in his prime.

 

meh I wouldn't say Norton was in his prime against Shavers.

 

That's the same as saying that you don't think I can read English, since you spelled out your point - in English.

Me not agreeing with your point is not the same as not understanding it.

And I disagree with your point, because your evidence is slim and because there are alternative explanations for it.

 

His chin was pretty good.
He just didn't get out of the way of Foreman's punches once big George started to really open up, he was a sitting duck.
Same thing with Shavers, where he made a worst mistake of trying to outbrawl Earnie.

 

Totally agree with you. Ken may not have an ATG chin but hardly a 'glass jaw' either.