Muhammad Ali was simply incredible. Look at this

One of my old roommates Robert “Stonewall” Jackson in his younger days was a sparring parnter for Ali during this time and talked about Ali still being formidable and surprisingly enough Ali was actually planning to make yet another comeback in 1984-1985, but according to Robert Ali’s people couldn’t get anybody to license Ali anymore.

Robert actually wanted the comeback to happen since he made more as a sparring partner for Ali in 1984 than he did fighting.

 

No, it's not. Herbert was Ali's manager (not just his boxing manager, the manager of his career). He took half of all the money Ali made. Herbert put Ali in with Holmes and Berbick when Ali had no business fighting, and everyone knew it. (Dundee didn't even stop the Holmes fight until Herbert gave him the signal from ringside to do so.) Even when countries were refusing to give Ali a boxing license, Herbert was shopping Ali around to countries with no athletic commissions. Because Herbert needed money.

By EVERY account, Ali was in miserable financial shape at the end of his career until he dropped Herbert in the early 90s (well, until his last wife dropped Herbert) and got new people to manage his affairs. He was still Ali's manager the entire decade of the 80s. What did he do for him that entire decade, other than the Holmes and Berbick debacles?

Ali never said a cross word about Herbert because he was Elijah Muhammad's son. But Ali's last wife dumped him the first chance she could, and turned Ali's finances over to professionals who actually knew what they were doing.

Hell, the new team took a guy who couldn't even speak and could barely walk on his own and got him national endorsement deals (after getting him free from the ridiculous deals he signed with Herbert as his manager) by understanding the value of his likeness ... and they got him a freaking MUSEUM that will be around for decades to come.

 

For the record, you're completely and utterly off base.
My father was on the team. He and Herbert were the two closest people to Ali.
And since Herbert is gone, nobody knows more about the inner workings of that time period better than him.
We still talk to Lonnie till this day. She is a good friend. Ali was never in miserable financial shape. Lonnie did not have the power to "dump Herbert."
Lonnie was very frustrated that Ali wasn't spending more time at home. He didn't want to. He enjoyed traveling and being with the people. Herbert had to convince him, which was the right thing to do. You can take that to the bank.

Ali was never controlled, puppeteered, or taken advantage of by his team. Ali was the man, not Herbert. People just eat these stories up, because some are more obsessed with drama, than they are with knowing the truth.

 

do you mind revealing us who your father is?

biographers thomas hauser and jonathan eig disagree with you.
did you read their books?

 

At this time yes I do.
But I can upload some photos and stuff.

I read Hausers book a long time ago.
These guys didn’t know .1% of what my father and Herbert knew. They would often embellish. These guys had an extremely surface level access into Ali’s life. They would maybe spend a few days with him. Herbert and my father were pretty much with him every day for years.

 

quoting myself, because i should specify more.
referring "miserable financial shape": hauser and eig didn´t use the exact term.
they indicated that muhammad´s financial matters - especially in the 70s and 80s until lonnie took over - were a complete mess: jumbled and chaotic. they didn´t claim, that ali was broke.
but even wikipedia says: "Ali's financial affairs improved in the 1990s after his management was taken over largely by his wife, Lonnie Ali. Ali's business affairs from the 1990s onward had little or nothing to do with [Herbert] Muhammad", indicating that his finances were worse before lonnie took over
(source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jabir_Herbert_Muhammad).
so we should define first, what "miserable financial shape" means.
in my view, disastrous finances can also be described as "miserable", even if one is not competely flatbroke.

if you don´t want to reveal your identity i can understand that, reznik.
but - if i were you - i wouldn´t have mentioned the connection through your father then.
after all it is the internet, where everybody can assert everything ...

p.s.: unfortunately it is apparently not possible to upload fotos here, which is a big deficiency of this messageboard.

 

Someone like Ali would never struggle to bring money in. His image and brand were priceless.

His personal fortunes did improve after that period of his life, and the main reason is that he finally settled down. When Ali was traveling during the 80’s with Herbert and my father, he was extremely charitable. He would give out money like it was nothing. He didn’t care about money, he just wanted to give it away. He would hand out bills when crowds gathered, which was very often. He would leave homeless people with hundreds of dollars when he passed them on the street. He would have groups of 50 people follow him to hotels, booking rooms under his name, much to the comical frustration of my pops and Herbert. He didn’t even know these people, and when Herbert and my pops interjected, he insisted. One time my father saw a lady buy a $10,000 fur coat at a hotel and put it under Ali’s name. Nobody knew who the lady was. My pops would say “Hey we can’t do this,” but Ali didn’t care, and they never second guessed him. They respected and admired him, and they were loyal. Herbert and my pops are the reason that Ali was able to live a lifestyle of giving for over a decade.

Money was most definitely coming in. My father was there for the negotiations, and eventually took charge in many of the deals. And he’s a very astute businessman. Ali would sign hundreds of blank sheets of paper for my dad to use to sign off on deals. We still have a bunch of them at my parents house.

Ali was very loose, out of kindness. Insisting on investing in bad businesses started by entrepreneurs he wanted to help. He could never say no or turn anyone away. He was leaking money like crazy, and Herbert and my pops worked like crazy to patch it up and keep the income flowing.

When he settled, he wasn’t doing that any more. He stayed at home and spent his time with his family. And endorsement deals only get bigger as time goes on and the market evolves. Lonnie didn’t have to follow a moving target that spent large sums of money spontaneously.

He was never in need of money. It was never a serious issue. His aim at the time wasn’t to build a fortune, it was to give his money away. When he settled with Lonnie, the gears shifted, which was a good thing.

I have no problem talking about this because it’s the truth, and I don’t mind sharing it, and correcting the record.

 

You keep skipping over the fact that they did indeed drop Herbert as Ali's manager.

You keep skipping over the terrible deals Ali signed with Herbert as his manager.

You keep skipping over the fact that he lived fight to fight, according to the people who weren't in the 'entourage' who tried to clean up his finances.

And you keep skipping over the fact that they DID DROP Herbert and got better managerial advice.

You totally ignore the complete MONEY GRABS by Herbert that were the Holmes and PARTICULARLY the Berbick fights. Herbert got half of both purses before Ali saw a dime.

And I said Ali never said a cross word about Herbert, because he was Elijah Muhammad's son.

I'm not arguing that they all disliked each other. You can like someone and not want them controlling your finances anymore.

Glad you all are still friends. I like all my friends. But I don't want my friends managing my money, either. (LOL)

 

Good to see.