the what fights did you watch today\scorecard thread.

I always liked Juan 'Baby Bull' Diaz. The guy had an incredible engine on him, but he met a cropper in Nate Campbell. Here we go.

Juan Diaz v Nate Campbell

Round 1: 10-10 Even
Round 2: 10-9 Diaz
Round 3: 10-9 Diaz
Round 4: 10-10 Even
Round 5: 10-9 Diaz
Round 6: 9-9 Even (Campbell's round but docked a point for 'butting')*
Round 7: 10-9 Campbell
Round 8: 10-9 Campbell
Round 9: 10-9 Campbell
Round 10: 10-9 Campbell
Round 11: 10-9 Campbell
Round 12: 10-9 Campbell

Total: 116-113 Campbell (actual scores: 114-113 Diaz and two scores of 116-111 and 115-112 both for Campbell for a split win)

*This was a poor call because it was a clean punch that caused Diaz' cut in the 6th. However, Campbell was guilty throughout the fight for use of the head, yet never incurred any further deductions in points, although he could have lost another or even flouted DQ. The ref just said continuously, "Hey, Hey Hey!"

This was an amazing performance by Campbell at 36 over his 24 year old opponent. He weathered Diaz furious assault early and never fatigued down the stretch. Those first 6 rounds were toughies to score. Harold Lederman, who had it 115-112 for Campbell, had it quite differently than my score early on until Campbell took over in the second half, even though our final tally is about the same. Diaz was slathering punches from all angles at a furious rate, whereas Campbell was picking his clean shots, so its really up to the judge on what they're seeing. Tough fight and it looked like they were going to retire Diaz late in the fight. But he made it to the end on heart alone.

Something no one really talks about are ring announcers. Before the decision was announced Lampley mentions to the TV audience that the announcer will probably screw this up, noting he'll screw up the suspense because he doesn't know what order to read them. Obviously they had been watching him in the undercard matches messing up results. I knew exactly what he was talking about when he mentioned it. It's an art holding the audience captive until you state the final name. I still cringe listening to old MSG fights and the ring announcer stating, "Ladies and gentlemen we have a unanimous decision. Judge so and so scores it 6-4 for Smith." Ok, stop right there. We get it. We know who won. You don't have to read the other two. Chuck Hull was also terrible for this but he eventually learned. But I grew up watching Jimmy Lennon, Sr. on old telecasts from the Olympic Auditorium and that man wrote the template back in the 60s or maybe even before that on how to read a score. Incidentally, the announcer for Campbell v Diaz did screw it up like Lampley assumed. Long gaps between scores, he gave Bill Clancy's score for Rick Bays' and the second score he read it in Spanish. My God!

 

That card was in Mexico so they let them run it.
Poor show from the Ring announcer.
Years later in another card in Mexico they had a malfunctioning mic that left Micheal Buffer disgusted when he announced the Angulo-Kirkland war.
I guess organization is not they’re strong point.

 

thats an interesting bit on the announcers. was lennon the first to announce it the way they do now when they do the suspense. I'm not as well versed in classic fights as the main posters in the thread but a lot of old fights seem to just read the scores not caring to create suspense

off topic sort of is the feeling i get when i watch a fight that i think is close but the narrative seems to be the favorite won but it was difficult but i think its closer than that and the judge reads the cards 115-113 Blue Corner! 115-113 Red Corner! then I hear 117-111 and then I know the favorite won because they would never score a landslide for the dog

 

George, I had to check this out after your recommendation. And you didn't undersell it. Just a terrific see-saw battle. I didn't have it quite as close as you. Your score was closer to the judges than mine, but this was the nature of this fight. I will agree with the commentators Alex Wallau and Dan Dierdorf. A toughie to score.

Round 1: 10-10 Even
Round 2: 10-9 Paez
Round 3: 10-9 Paez
Round 4: 10-9 Paez
Round 5: 10-9 Espinosa
Round 6: 10-9 Espinosa
Round 7: 10-9 Paez
Round 8: 10-9 Paez
Round 9: 10-10 Even
Round 10: 10-9 Paez
Round 11: 10-9 Paez
Round 12: 10-9 Paez

Total: 118-112 Paez (actual scores: 115-113 Paez, 116-113 Espinosa and 114-114 for a Draw decision)

This fight comes down to what your tastes are. Are you more impressed with Paez' bombs or Espinosa's steady boxing. I wonder if the rematch was as good.

 

It was, though from memory Paez deserved it. Can't remember now. Didn't it end in a draw?

 

The rematch looks like a split win for Paez, so it looks like another close one.

 

Kidd, here is the second fight between Sho Saijo and Raul Rojas when the title changed hands back in '68. Check out Jimmy Lennon in his Nehru jacket and chains. But let me tell you, while they were still screwing it up in New York, he had it down pat when announcing that result. Even though the crowd likely knew Rojas lost it, you weren't getting anything less than suspense from Jimmy Lennon. He announces the result at the 52:10 mark.

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I was perusing youtube for some good fights and found something I never knew was out there. The second fight between Mando Ramos and Teo Cruz for Cruz' lightweight title. Cruz had retained his title on a 15 round decision in their first fight (after Ramos went out with Raul Rojas for a night on the town the night before their respective bouts - btw, both lost). But here we go. California rules of 1 point for a round, 2 if there is a knockdown and 0 points for an even round.

Round 1: Ramos
Round 2: Cruz
Round 3: Cruz
Round 4: Ramos
Round 5: Ramos
Round 6: Ramos
Round 7: Even
Round 8: Cruz
Round 9: Ramos
Round 10: Ramos
Round 11: Ramos stops Cruz

Total through 10 completed rounds: 6-3 Ramos (actual scores: 5-3 Ramos, 6-3 Cruz and 4-4 Even)

This was about the most contained I ever saw Ramos. He didn't get into any unnecessary dustups - which was really against type for him - kept the jab and combos moving and whacked the body every chance he could. But even still, Cruz got through with a very refined overhand right and uppercut. Still, I felt Ramos' work was better and it was a very nice and tidy fight that I enjoyed seeing for the first time.

 

Kid Gavilan v Gil Turner

Good fight in which the young challenger really took it to the champ, showing great handspeed and combos before he was slowly worn down and properly battered for a well-timed (by 1950s standards, at least) stoppage.

Gavilan was very economical, almost to a fault in the early going, with his punch output. However, he knew what he was doing and weathered the storm such that, even though I had Turner marginally ahead going into the 11th - 5 rounds to 4 (1 even) - he looked to have turned things his way just as he got to the business end of the fight. A study in how to pace yourself in a 15 round championship fight.

1 9-10
2 9-10
3 9-10
4 10-9
5 10-9 (close)
6 9-10
7 9-10 (close)
8 10-9 (close)
9 10-10
10 10-9
(95-96)
11 Gavilan TKO Turner

 

Not much to add to this in terms of analysis, Scar - you've described it perfectly, although I had it closer than you did - dead even going into the 12th. I thought Cruz was well in the fight going into that round so the way it ended was a little anticlimactic but it was a really high quality bout all the way through.

Loris Stecca v Leo Cruz
1 9-10
2 10-9
3 10-9 (close)
4 9-10 (close again)
5 10-9
6 9-10
7 10-9
8 9-10
9 9-10 (great round)
10 10-9 (close. Breather round)
11 9-9 (somewhat harsh point deduction)
(104-104)
12 Stecca TKO Cruz

 

Roberto Duran v Leoncio Ortiz

It's December 1975 and Duran is making his 7th consecutive defense of the title he won three and a half years earlier from Ken Buchanan. Hard to believe he's still only 24 here as he has firmly established himself by this point of his reign as one of the pre-eminent champions in this and any other weight division.

Ortiz tried to counter and had some success but it was fleeting and I found it hard to give him rounds. He was tough though and took some punishment. The knockdown that late in the fight looked unlikely but it was a perfectly placed uppercut through the middle of Ortiz's guard and he never threatened to beat the count.

1 10-9
2 10-9
3 10-9
4 10-9
5 10-9
6 10-9
7 10-9
8 10-9
9 10-9
10 10-9
11 10-9
12 10-10
13 10-9
14 10-9
(140-127)
15 Duran KO Ortiz

 

Jose Napoles v Ernie Lopez 2

Good, competitve match for the first few rounds before Napoles stepped up his workrate and punctuated his performance with a perfect and rare type of counter - an uppercut countering a straight right from Lopez. It was so immaculately thrown and timed that Lopez just dropped like a stone when it connected and there was absolutely no chance of him making it up from that.

1 10-9
2 9-10
3 10-9 (close)
4 9-10 (close)
5 10-9 (good action; Napoles stepped it up at the end)
6 10-9
(58-56)
7 Napoles KO Lopez

 

Ortiz hurt Duran with several shots early in the fight as I recall it, but nobody ever seems to bring it up.

 

He landed some shots but I didn't think Duran was hurt. If I thought Ortiz was legitimately winning rounds, I'd have scored them his way. He did well enough in there to keep surviving and he was throwing shots, but in my opinion wasn't winning rounds.

 

Jel, I don't think I've read much on it, but at the time there seemed to be much concern over the state of Lopez' left eye, which was mainly why he went down like he was shot. One can see him clutching the eye when he was down. Obviously nothing permanent because he was back in the ring 5 months later with Armando Muniz. But I recall watching the Muniz-Lopez fight back in '73 and ring commentator Jim Healy stating something to the effect that Napoles almost lifted his eye out of the socket. Again, it must have been superficial but probably very scary for the Lopez camp at the time.