Most wasted talent

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Reinhardt, Dec 24, 2020.

  1. scartissue

    scartissue Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Bernard 'Superbad' Mays
    Frankie Duarte
    Toluco Lopez
     
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  2. robert ungurean

    robert ungurean Богдан Philadelphia Full Member

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    Eddie Mustapha Muhammad Gregory was capable of more
     
  3. Roughhouse

    Roughhouse Active Member Full Member

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    I'll offer an obscure one: Leslie "Sweet Lemonade" Gardner. He was a topflight amateur and a close friend of Superbad Mays and was considered to be a future champ but fell into serious drug addiction not long after turning pro and ended up dying young and is buried in an unmarked grave in Detroit from what I have heard. He was rated very highly at the beginning of his career but never attained more than main event journeyman status. He came to Indianapolis and lost to Gary Guiden at the Sherwood on a New Years Eve show and then overdosed not too many months afterwards.
     
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  4. Thread Stealer

    Thread Stealer Loyal Member Full Member

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    Michael Nunn
    Hector Camacho
     
  5. Richard M Murrieta

    Richard M Murrieta Now Deceased 2/4/25 Full Member

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    I really believe that if Gerry Cooney had better management he could have developed into a better fighter. To have him fight a couple of has beens like Ken Norton and Jimmy Young only helped his career for a short period. But if slowly they could have matched him with better competition than looking for a meal ticket, he could have grown like Jerry Quarry did in the late 1960's and early 1970's. If he could have fought the likes of people more his age like Greg Page, Tim Witherspoon, and Pinklon Thomas. Those fights would have better prepared him for the champion Larry Holmes. Management wise, if he could have been taken under the wing by Cus D Amato and Kevin Rooney, he would have been taught the fundamentals.. He would not gave been treated like the latest political novelty, which in reality he was.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2020
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  6. PernellSweetPea

    PernellSweetPea Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    It would have been good to put him in there with a guy who is not a threat offensively, but takes a good punch so he goes the distance and learns certain things about the pace and tricks and all that. Going the distance is one of the best things for fighters. I remember reading once that Murray Sutherland who had fought Hearns, was going to fight Ernie Singletary,who Hearns had fought also. Hearns told him don't try to knock him out, since going for the knockout would change the dynamic. So Murray won the fight in a long fight. I think that was for the SuperMiddleweight title.

    Cooney going 12 or 15 ,or even 8 or 9 with a top rated guy a few times would have helped him. I am not sold on the fact Cooney had that deep motivation to take a long career in boxing the way Duran or Hagler or Hearns or Holmes did. I don't think he loved boxing as much as he loved what boxing gave him. That motivation to lose and get better is what makes guys better, and to me he had his big moment and then gave up a little looking for either the huge fight or nothing.
     
  7. Richard M Murrieta

    Richard M Murrieta Now Deceased 2/4/25 Full Member

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    I totally agree, it was kind of sad for Gerry, he was a likeable fellow but he was a meal ticket for his management. Kind of reminds me of fictional character Paco Moreno from the 1956 motion picture, The Harder They Fall, with Humphrey Bogart, Max Baer Sr, and Jan Sterling. Moreno fights a slew of has been's, then gets massacred by Baer, gets his jaw broken. That is what Gerry Cooney reminded me of, kind of sad. They threw him in with Larry Holmes, he was far from ready, you are right, he needed to learn how to go the distance.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2020
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  8. Xplosive

    Xplosive Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Michael Nunn and Miguel Lora can be added.

    Both had ATG level talent - never really reached the level of ATG.

    Both deserve in the HOF though.
     
  9. PernellSweetPea

    PernellSweetPea Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I never saw that movie. I will look for it. In retrospect some guys would have been great for Gerry to fight. Even Tex Cobb with that great chin. Gerry goes the distance with him and that would help him. Going the distance for knockout punchers is important. I mean Hearns was a guy who had early knockouts, but he went 10 rounds or more I think 17 times. Many guys would have lost interest after the Ray fight in 1981, but he fought Singletary less than 3 months after which to me was amazing that he was allowed to that soon after being stopped and fought another 35 times. Although Hearns was much greater than Cooney, they both were punchers. Cooney had 113 total rounds and Hearns 378.. more than 3 times the rounds. So that is a big difference in motivation, although Hearns had more potential and he had 163 amateur fights. Maybe Hearns is not the right comparison. Even Wilder. Wilder seems more motivated than Gerry. Felix Trinidad after Hopkins. He still was around and motivated. Rosario always fought even if he lost and had that upset against Loreto Garza. But the comparison was there as far as going the distance. Meaning if you we put Evander Holyfield's mind in Gerry Cooney's body I wonder how that motivation would have helped Gerry down the road. I remember back in I think it was 1986 and on television one weekend Cooney fought Eddie Gregg at the Cow Palace in California I think. It stood out because Gerry was fighting so sporadically.
     
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  10. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist

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    Not sure about putting guys with mental problems on the list. Boxing is a mental game to begin with.
     
  11. Richard M Murrieta

    Richard M Murrieta Now Deceased 2/4/25 Full Member

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    As I said, I do agree with you. But if Gerry had found someone who would have worked with him, like a Cus D Amato or even an Eddie Futch, he would have succeeded, but you are correct, if he had the Holyfield mentality, he would have possibly been a better contender.
     
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  12. PernellSweetPea

    PernellSweetPea Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I don't know what happened to Nunn. Sometimes I think HBO -as good as they were marketing hurt guys careers. I don't know enough about how they matched fighters, but maybe the pressure of being in the spotlight or maybe it was the Goossens. It worked with Tyson, but Nunn? He won with Tate well... Looked almost unbeatable in size and speed. Then he fights Roldan and goes 8 rounds and to me struggled a bit and was hit more than I thought he should have been, but Roldan has that awkward style so maybe people just thought ok he struggled against a guy who makes guys look bad. Then Nunn knocks out Kalambay and maybe that mentally changes his tactics for fights where he tried to duplicate things by thinking he had power. With Barkley it was like Roldan again. Struggling and winning with speed, but getting roughed up a bit. Then Starling and Curry and Toney, which he won against Starlin and Curry but he was hit a little, but his size made him handle that well. Those were fights he could have and should have showcased his skills and something just did not dominate like he did against Tate. So I wondered what the Roldan,Kalambay and Barkley fights did to him as far as confidence and tactics. In my mind Nunn needed an Emanuel Steward to give him the style to win and stick to it. He should have always fought like he did against Tate. With Curry it was a case of stylistic problems by staying in front of guys waiting for his own counter.
     
  13. greynotsoold

    greynotsoold Boxing Addict

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    Chamuco Martinez.
     
  14. escudo

    escudo Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Seriously if you never watched Rigo win those medals he looked like a mix of Roy and Sweet pea.
     
  15. Richard M Murrieta

    Richard M Murrieta Now Deceased 2/4/25 Full Member

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    Remember Sugar Ray Seales and Duane Bobick from the 1972 Olympics.