Rocky Marciano vs Primo Carnera

"I couldn't avoid those jabs. I just had to take them"

This picture taken of him the morning after the fight seems to support that.

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Great post.

 

Watch the fight Swag it's really that simple. I don't care what he says it's all there on film. Almost all of them talk shyte at times. Louis was his boyhood idol and on top of that Marciano was a very gracious man.

Some marks after a heavyweight fight mean very little. Don't forget the detractors have told us for years how easily Marciano cut and marked up.

 

You can't say that about literally any boxer. That's just it.
A lot of fighters are inconsistent, both in their training and mental approach, especially over a career.
Rocky was a 'clutch' fighter. He did always find a way to win. Him being unbeaten shows that.

Whatever your thoughts on Marciano, you have to give him that.

 

He beat and lost to Stribling both by DQ.. Stribling was also 3 inches taller than Marciano and weighed more than him (granted it was only 5-10 pounds).

Gains was 4 inches taller and was 200 lbs and out-boxed Carnera which was neither Marciano's style nor something he was capable of doing.

Sharkey was also 10-20 pounds heavier than The Rock and also employed a gameplan against Carnera Marciano was incapable of emulating.

I can't speak of the Maloney loss, as their is no footage of it and very little news coverage of it but at 195 lbs, he was heavier than Marciano was in his entire career.

That being said, I never said Carnera would beat Marciano. I said I was simply not sure, who would come out on top given Carnera had significant advantages. I agree he lacked power despite his size, and was a clumsy oaf, and I said so myself in the very post you quoted.

 

Sorry turning Carnera into some monster puncher based on dropping Schaaf with a jab is what’s delusional. You do realise Schaaf was likely already dying from a cerebral haemorrhage at this point?? Or do you you think that single left jab is what done him in? What nonsense!

What about the umpteen other fimed fights where Carnera pawed and mauled with his size but did **** all with his fists?
Marciano took flush bombs from better punchers than Carnera whose “impressive” KO percentage is based on some careful match making and dubious performances by his opposition. This is common knowledge. Carnera by and large pawed with his jab. It had nothing on it to keep Marciano off with. The corpse of Louis put more on his jab than Primo ever did. Once Marciano gets inside then Carnera has nothing but a clinch to save him. His inside game was non existent and simply trying to clinch isn’t going to be enough over a long fight against a guy who mastered breaking down an opponent who tried to defend against him that way.

I’m comfortable backing Marciano after having watched Carnera get slapped repeatedly to the floor by some bar room swings by Max Baer who was more crude than Marciano was on the worst day of his life. Being a few inches taller and heavier doesn’t give a guy as crude as Baer any edge over Marciano whatsoever yet Carnera couldn’t defend himself against those wild haymakers.

Carnera just wasn’t that good and his massive size while it got him a long way wouldn’t be nearly enough against a fighter like Marciano.

 

If you can’t see the difference in his style on film there is nothing I can do for you. It’s rather obvious. And a year of training professionally is a lifetime for a man who had only been boxing a few years. Marciano started so late he literally was learning till his last fight. His style come Archie was perfected. Watch how smooth he looked despite losing a lot of his explosiveness.
Besides PC lost to several men Rocky’s height that were far worse fighters. You’re whole argument is that of a size queen. Well it doesn’t really fit this narrative. Might want to try again.

 

Tbh I would favor the Baer of the Schmeling and Carnera fights to beat Marciano as well. In this bout, it could very well go either way. I don't think Carnera had the punching power to turn out Marciano's lights, like vice versa so I ever so slightly lean towards Rock, but he would have to go to hell to do so.

I will say this though, even though I favor Marciano, the people going for Carnera are arguing his case much better.

 

Is that your argument “it’s a cop out”. It’s a poor one. Walcott, Charles, and Moore also had excellent jabs. Moore’s is rather exceptional actually. Rocky had no problem getting past those. Rocky on film is obviously more polished come Matthews on. This shouldn’t be debatable. Was Tua able to reach his large opponents? Tyson? Frazier? Why would Marcianos 5”10 size be any different? Or the several individuals in the 5”11 area thag were able to beat Primo? You’re reaching rather far on this one. Primo neither has the power or skills to keep Marciano off of him. Marciano had more power, better defense, stamina, chin, etc. Marciano could control the inside action probably better then anyone Primo has faced. Only guy to give Marciano issues on the inside was Charles and that was because of his skill. Marciano would negate the height advantage by getting inside and controlling the fight from there. Marciano also wasn’t a head first fighter like say Frazier or Tyson. His style was different. His lean and crouch style made him less susceptible to uppercuts and was better for countering. Unless you can show me all these fights where Marciano got lit up by uppercuts at his best I’d change your thinking on that one.

 

95% of Classic do not watch film extensively, if at all, yet comment with certainty. This applies to nearly all fantasy match ups posted here, for any weight.

 

You're certainly singing a different tune on Carnera in this thread Cobe.

He can suddenly jab and fight outside and going down 10 times in one bout is now a plus and not a huge negative.

More interesting is your summation of the bout just seven months ago. Be true to yourself mate -

Glass City Cobra on Carnera - Marciano

Rocky KO round 11 in one of the ugliest but very action packed bouts in heavyweight history. Combine Rocky vs Vingo and Carnerna vs Louis and you have a good idea of how it would look. Carnera has success early but ultimately is too frail and uncoordinated to win a fire fight here. If he knew how to properly fight like a big man and has Emmanuel Steward in his corner...perhaps he could pull off the impossible. But the way Carnera actually was, I don't see him winning outside of a 1 in 20 punchers chance (I don't even give him a 1/10 chance since Rocky had a solid chin and good recovery while Carnera didn't exactly have devastating power for such a large man and wasn't a great finisher either).