Where would you rank a 1-0 fighter whose only victory is FOTC Ali?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by cross_trainer, Aug 27, 2021.


  1. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Imagine that instead of the battle tested heavyweight champion we all know and love, Joe Frazier was a 0-0 former Olympic medalist who challenged Ali for the title in 1971. Like the Pete Rademacher / Patterson situation.

    Incredibly, Frazier proceeds to win a near-duplicate of the Fight of the Century. Then, at the peak of his popularity and sporting a shiny new 1-0 record, Frazier retires to become a successful professional singer.

    Ali continues fighting, mostly successfully. He manages to more or less accumulate the same incredible record that he did in real life.

    How would you rate a fighter like the 1-0 Rademacher-esque version of Frazier who holds a single incredible win...but that's it? Where would you put him on your list of the greatest heavyweight champs?

    And why?
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2021
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  2. Kamikaze

    Kamikaze Bye for now! banned Full Member

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    "Rademacher" Frazier > "Saint" Preem Carnera- :borra2:
     
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  3. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Actually curious to hear your rating decision on this admittedly eccentric topic.
     
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  4. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Also, @janitor had better get in on this at some point...
     
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  5. Kamikaze

    Kamikaze Bye for now! banned Full Member

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    Rademacher Frazier is our son- So will try to be as unbiased as I can. (Soon)
     
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  6. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    :risas3:
     
  7. GoldenHulk

    GoldenHulk Boxing Addict Full Member

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    He might retire, but he wouldn't make it as a proffesional singer, Joe was pretty awful at singing, unlike Ernie Terrell.
     
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  8. Kamikaze

    Kamikaze Bye for now! banned Full Member

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    Okay- Rademancher Frazier!

    Now he would have the single greatest win in HW history. No doubt amplified by the fact he did it in his pro debut. followed by Vander-Bowe and Louis-Schmelling. Where you would rank Ali must also be affected in the equation but for the sake of making life easier lets say he beat a fighter of Frazier's equal 2-1 and he is still held in the same respect as H2H#1 HW.

    I have a feeling he would suffer in some ways- "He just had the right style" ect no doubt the arguments for Ali's decline would truly be "realized" in such a situation amplified even and the 70s would take a hit, a big one. circular reason of Ali struggling with someone amplifying there greatness would cease to be, How good could Foreman be or Norton, Lyle ect ect be if Rademancher Frazier could just mic drop the boxing world. People that excuse the FOTC outcome would be taken a lot more seriously.

    The other side of the coin is that Rademancher Frazier was the biggest what if in boxing histroy... could he maintain that ability? would he even try given he became bigger then MJ as musician? If his heart was in boxing would he be the GOAT? He would appear twice a day minimum on every boxing forum on the planet. We would spend hours watching his AM footage dissecting every piece. The outcome we would get logically in my opinion is "Ali must not have been that good" considering what we have of AM Radezier and how he made his debut after the Tokyo Olympics which would also have happened in the 70s instead LOL. Or he was "The greatest to ever lace them up"
    Both extremes are possible with some mental gymnastics but neither will truly be recognized as a conscientious answer. But as described in my first block of text about Ali's maintained status. I would have him outside the top ten.

    I would rate him higher then Rocky, Dempsey, Braddock, Carnera, Baer, Mercer, Morrison, Schemlling (Yep) Lyle ect, ect. Pretty much anyone you would rate Smokin Joe over H2H would stay the same (More guys actually) and legacy wise he would be in the top 20 no doubt, 15 is very possible, but top ten is impossible to me.
     
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  9. Dempsey1238

    Dempsey1238 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think it in the long run it would really hurt Ali's standing as a ATG.
     
  10. Kamikaze

    Kamikaze Bye for now! banned Full Member

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    Oh in this time line Rademancher Frazier would be bigger then Johnny Cash, MJ , you name it its part of the equation you see.
     
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  11. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Although totally irrelevant to the boxing question, this is correct.
     
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  12. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    As to the timing of the Tokyo Olympics, I imagine Rademacher Frazier still winning the same one he did in real life, but then mysteriously vanishing from the public eye to train in solitude until his big day finally came.

    Well, training with sparring partners and such, but you know.

    It has the dual advantages of preserving the rest of the timeline and adding to the mystique. (Or if you prefer, surrealism.)
     
  13. Kamikaze

    Kamikaze Bye for now! banned Full Member

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    I think this helps Radenamcher Frazier in some ways and saves Ali- just how much did he improve in the time span from the Tokyo Olympics?
    How dedicated was he during this period? ect, ect who knows. The more fog the better.
     
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  14. Kamikaze

    Kamikaze Bye for now! banned Full Member

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  15. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

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    Well Ali would probably be bursting to get him back in the ring. I don't think it sits well with him that he's lost to a novice like that.
    He'd be calling out the guy, saying it was a robbery, he hurt the other man more etc.
    It would definitely have a negative foot note in Alis career.