The Best of the Rest: 160lbs Tier II Tournie - THE FINAL:Lloyd Marshall SD15 Mike McCallum

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by McGrain, Sep 14, 2021.



Who will win?

Poll closed Sep 17, 2021.
  1. Lloyd T/KO

    6.3%
  2. Lloyd Points

    50.0%
  3. McCallum Points

    31.3%
  4. McCallum T/KO

    12.5%
  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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  2. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Marshall was a better fighter IMO. He looks great on the film vs Charles and Mills, and I tend to think he'd be able to better McCallum in the experience department. He had one tough schedule. He'd have to stay deft and alert, but I think he's got a win in him. He's beaten better.
     
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  3. AwardedSteak863

    AwardedSteak863 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I couldn't have said it better myself. McCallum fought into his forties over multiple weight classes against some of the deadliest punchers ever and was never stopped. On the other hand Marshall who was an excellent fighter was stopped at least ten times and would be going against one of the better counterpunchers ever. I think he gets stopped here. As much as I respect Marshall for all that he accomplished, he was just too inconsistent for me to pick him over the consistently great McCallum.
     
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  4. robert ungurean

    robert ungurean Богдан Philadelphia Full Member

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  5. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    No way are people letting McCallum win after his win over Kalambay in the semis!
     
  6. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    The final always looked like it would be one of the post-Hagler middleweights from the late 80s and early 90s against one of the Murderer's Row.
     
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  7. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    McCallum was a fantastic fighter who was technically excellent, had a great chin and a good boxing IQ, but he was a relatively slight middleweight who lacked a real punch at the weight and he could outslicked as Kalambay showed.

    I wonder if Marshall's size, his unorthodoxy and his power would prove to be McCallum's kryptonite. I can see McCallum hanging tough but never solving Marshall and being on the wrong end of a clear decision.
     
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  8. AwardedSteak863

    AwardedSteak863 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Maybe, but that one loss at Middleweight to a prime Kalambay was a damn close fight. McCallum was pretty consistent all of his career and regularly fought the toughest of opponents in their own back yard. No one was ever really close to stopping him but Marshal was stopped 11 times. Both guys deserve respect for fighting the best of their era's but too me McCallum was far more consistent. I don't see Marshall stopping him and he really wasn't much of a mover like Kalambay.
     
  9. Jester

    Jester Active Member Full Member

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    I think Marshall's unorthodox technique and attack befuddle McCallum and offset his rhythm enough for Marshall to pick up a decision. McCallum was a great fighter, but if Marshall could get past Burley, Williams and Charles, I really don't see what McCallum could present that Lloyd wouldn't be able to cope with.
     
  10. Minotauro

    Minotauro Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Tough fight to call never thought about this match up before. Initially thought Marshall but then thought McCallum via razor thin decision.
     
  11. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    Whoever picked Marshall to win by KO, I’d really like to hear your reasoning.
     
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  12. AwardedSteak863

    AwardedSteak863 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Agreed! McCallum never was really close to being slept in the ring. 36 rounds with Toney, Prime Roy Jones, Julian Jackson, Curry, Collins, Watson etc. He was fantastic defensively and had an iron chin to boot. Too bad he didn't get to fight the legends that Marshall did. I have no doubt that McCallum would do well in any era. He truly was a complete fighter.
     
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  13. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    Absolutely. He was extremely durable and had outstanding defensive skills too. I don’t even think Marshall was much of a puncher
     
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  14. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

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    Let's not have this end in a controversial decision again. Any more takers?

    EDIT: Damn - poll has closed.
     
  15. Tin_Ribs

    Tin_Ribs Me Full Member

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    Of those 11 stoppages pal, seven of them were to Charles, Moore, Bivins, Oakland Billy Smith and Ceferino Garcia on cuts. Most of those lads were bigger, stronger and harder hitting than Mike at 160. A few of the other stoppage losses came at the end for him too. So there's context there to a considerable point. Dropping decisions to the other row fighters while beating them as well is expected unless you're a freak like Robinson, Greb, Armstrong, Duran etc, and some of those defeats were competitive and close. McCallum was a bit avoided and lacking support and backing on his own time, he'd be an outright pariah in the 40s and probably only known to hardcore enthusiasts like us and well-versed historians. It's not like he was better than the most of the row, he'd probably be incurring his share of wins and defeats and isn't going to knock out the likes of Charles imo. Imagine if he hadn't gotten the decisions in the Graham fight, Kalambay I or a draw with Toney etc? All of which are perfectly arguable. He could have come out worse than he did in a weaker era than Marshall fought in, albeit still a strong one, and he did have a steadiness and immovability to him that Marshall lacked I suppose, though Marshall was bigger and more powerful. It's easy to see McCallum taking one in a real time series scenario taking into account peaks and dips etc. But not hard to see why Marshall could be favoured h2h.
     
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