Has The Now Mythical Skillset Of The Gypsy King Been Vastly Overstated & Blown Out Of Proportion?

For me best british boxer I had sparred with was Nigel Benn.
I will not judge in depth ppl IF I had not them in the ring.
I just can't do this. I also was more KBer not boxer.

 

Boxed Ears has Boner for Broner

 

Okay @CST80 my friend, time to do justice to your thought provoking thread.

First of all whether this thread pisses off peaople or not is irrelevant especially if it contains cogent and incisive points. Our mutual distinguised friend @Serge Esq might take issue with the title as he believes Gypsy are the greatest fighting clan and his cousin is a certain Luke Tyson Fury popularly known as Tyson too Fast Fury or the Gypsy King. There have been some great fighters from all over the world including my own African bethren as exemplified by Uncle Azumah Nelson and my country man the Great Dick Tiger, Batting Siki and others but I have always been consistent in saying the best fighters in the world and in the history of boxing come from the Mid west USA. Whenever I have a guy who is to fight someone from the Mid West extra alerts go up.

You posed the question "Is Fury really a master boxer"? The answer is no he is not the master boxer people and his fan boys want to think he is. He is not Muhammed Ali, Larry Holmes or Usyk nor is he Riddick Bowe, Lennox Lewis or even "Terrible Tim" Witherspoon. I mention Terrible Tim on pupose because he was at ringside and frankly whilst it was an entertaining fight he was far from impressed about the skills of both Fury and Wilder and people who understand the sweet science will understand this.

Re Chisora and Hammer fights you are spot on and in Chisora's case in particular especially the first fight you might have been tempted to write Fury off.

I was won who predicted Fury would beat another Dr No in Wladimir Klitschko. The points you have made on this are valid and correct except for the use of the word coward. No guy who gets into the ring is a coward but Klitschko had morphed into a defensive style fighter who made his fights no contests by relying on his size and physical advantages as well as talent. He even developed better footwork. Emmanuel Steward the great Manny Steward really had a lot to answer for in enabling Klitschko to be a long term world champion. I know Manny would have preferred Klitschko to be a gunslinger like Thomas Hearns but he could not even Lennox Lewis would not always let it all hang out. Styles as the saying goes makes fights and the reason I predicted and knew Fury would win was because Klitschko would be forced to become the aggressor to win and he was totally uncomfortable in that role. Frankly needed to fight Fury in the manner he fought AJ a couple of year later more aggressively and with movement to win.

As for Wilders terrible skills you will note even before the first fight how much I have sopken about this and predicted a Fury win. In fact Wilder should have lost both times to Ortiz but for the fact Ortiz who was outboxing him and hurt him could not finish him off due to his advanced years and Wilder/s right hand power equaliser. To support your points here I have always referred to Wilder's skill levels as agricultural in other words basic.

Otto Wallin fight your points are well made and if Wallin who there is genuine doubt is not an elite fighter then what dores that say about Fury's mythical skill level.

People seem to assume that based on Saturday Fury would mow down both Usyk and AJ which is far from clear at all and in fact both could beat Fury as genuine possibilities. Usyk is by far the most skilful heavyweight today and if his fight with Fury and AJ rematch is purely down to skills then I know who I would pick. The truth is fanboy delusion always happens. As you know I am an AJ fan but have never been blind to shortcoming in his development especially being trained by Robert McCracken who is not good enough by any stretch of imagination. AJ would benefit from having a serious knowlegeable skills coach like Terrible Tim Witherspoon or Floyd Mayweather Snr/Junior.

Fury is a big SOB with enough skills for this era and knows how to use his size especially in the stylistic match ups and opponents to date particularly Wilder and Klitschko. A similar tactics he used against Wilder vs AJ would bring AJ's fantastic right upper cut into play and a knockout loss.

Fury thinks he is the greatest ever and would have beaten heavyweights of the past which is crap. He is very beatable and I will put money on AJ and Usyk beating him potentially and the one guy he should not face if he is smart is the problem in the Juggernaut Joe Joyce. The truth is Fury is a very good boxer who is the beneficiary of the lower skills levels in this era with the exception of Usyk and AJ. Where I give full credit to Fury is doing what he has needed to do to win.

 

Epic!!

 

People will be shocked how sloppy Fury will look compared to Louis, he missed 90% of his right hands v Wilder.

 

You sparred with Benn?

 

Fury's skill wasn't much on display against Wallin, even before the cut that people like to bring up to mitigate that performance. Lots of telegraphed, winging shots that Wallin saw coming a mile away, sloppy jabwork, poor control of distance, lunging in exposing his head, squaring up his feet, generally playing the bigger more oafish man in the contest when he should have been the one out-skilling and outclassing Wallin.

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You could argue Fury wasn't at his best there, but even were that the case there's no excuse for the general cluelessness Fury displayed in dealing with Wallin, his inability to cope with Wallin's pecking jab, and his generally poor repetitive work against a fighter he should have figured out by around the fifth round.

It's this fight more than any other that leads me to believe he gets outclassed by Usyk. Not that I expect he'll fight as poorly as this; I fully believe he'll bring his A game. But when faced with a fighter able to match and exceed him skill for skill I can't see him being able to adapt or impose himself sufficiently for his size to play a deciding factor.

 

Says the guy that rated wilder

 

Probably explains the incoherence

Sorry Surrix, if you have sparred HOF’ers like Benn fair play it’s just that Eastern European style doesn’t translate so well on an English speaking forum.