What if Johansson had retired after beating Patterson?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by djanders, Oct 25, 2021.


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  1. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Okay. Ingemar Johansson beats Floyd Patterson (in what became known as Johansson - Patterson 1) and then retires, never to return to the ring. How is he viewed today? What happens in the Heavyweight Division he leaves behind?
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
    djanders, Oct 25, 2021
    djanders, Oct 25, 2021
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  2. Pepsi Dioxide

    Pepsi Dioxide Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This is going to be similar to the Pete Radenmacher thread (if Radenmacher beats Floyd and retires). It would be looked at as a weird blip in heavyweight history. Patterson is matched up with... Liston for the vacant title? A small contingent of people hold fast with the idea that Ingo is some kind of all time great that could beat all sorts of heavyweights we are pretty sure he couldn't.
     
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  3. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Look at what Ring Magazine was saying at the time.

    They expected him to be around for a while!
     
    janitor, Oct 25, 2021
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  4. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    So we get a retired Johansson (declaring he's lost interest in fighting and has nothing left to prove) with 22 wins, NO losses, and 12 knockouts (including a 5th round KO of Henry Cooper, a first round KO of Eddie Machen, and a 3rd round KO of Lineal Champion, Floyd Patterson). It looks to me like he'd have a better case than Rademacher.
     
    djanders, Oct 25, 2021
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  5. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I think it's quite possible that, given the premise of this thread, Ingo would be in top 10 discussions today, and rarely left out of the top 15. It just goes to show how tricky these things can get.
     
    djanders, Oct 25, 2021
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  6. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    He basically has the same number of elite wins as Fury.
     
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  7. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Yeah, there would definitely be that sense that Floyd or Liston are placeholder champions "until Ingo makes a comeback" for a few years. Which probably enters the boxing zeitgeist, as most what-if questions do, and gets blown out of proportion until Ingo's "lost years" become the stuff of legend and endless forum fantasizing.

    A bit like the people who constantly speculate about how Bobby Fischer could have come back and crushed the current chess champion(s) after his early retirement.

    EDIT: Or like Ibeabuchi for that matter.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2021
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  8. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    :comp4:
     
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  9. Pepsi Dioxide

    Pepsi Dioxide Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    100% I could see this happening.
     
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  10. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Liston would probably be even more bitter, if that is even possible. Not only isn't he accepted as a beloved champion, but he's also considered a paper belt holder for Ingo's throne.

    Patterson, meanwhile, has the dubious distinction of being the guy warming the title for not one, but two retired unbeaten guys.
     
    cross_trainer, Oct 25, 2021
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  11. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Ingo would run a bunch of marathons and date a bunch of attractive models, actresses and ladies about town.

    Floyd would fight Sonny for the vacant title and get exiled to KO 1 Street but wouldn’t get the rematch.

    Sonny would defend a couple of times before losing to Ali but wouldn’t be regarded as a ‘true champion’ in the way Norton isn’t.
     
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  12. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    At the time, I believe Floyd Patterson was the #1 contender and Nino Valdez was #2, according to Ring Magazine. Johansson retires and Patterson regains the title by beating Valdez. Floyd doesn't even have the confidence of knowing he beat Johansson twice after losing in such devastating fashion. His people find a way to duck Liston forever, finally losing the title to Muhammad Ali. It's really very interesting what might have developed from there.
     
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  13. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Also interesting is the idea that Floyd tries to take Ali early -- pre Cooper. A prime-ish Floyd with a healthy back has a left hook just like Cooper did...
     
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  14. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Yes! Maybe Floyd sneaks in a decision win over a green Ali, possibly dropping Ali once. Later Ali fights Liston and beats him, because of styles. For Floyd, the Liston problem is gone now. The fun goes on. Floyd's stock keeps rising, and Johansson, as the guy who beat Floyd, starts to show up in TOP 5 discussions. :p
     
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  15. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 MONZON VS HAGLER 2025 banned Full Member

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