64 Liston vs 74 Ali

73-74 was Ali's best years post exile imo. He was in very good shape in those years he would stop Liston again imo. A prime Liston would be a much more interesting matchup.

 

64 Liston did not train seriously for his fight with Ali and was way older than stated. 74 Ali was just 32 years old.
This is not a a fair comparison. But since you asked, if he trains properly, Liston can win since 74 Ali did not quite have the same legs, but it's not guaranteed.

 

Prime Liston makes this one interesting, because he would pace himself in Zaire. But Ali could very well decision him.

 

Liston

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win. It's impossible for someone who has defeated such low quality of opposition throughout their entire career to defeat such a high level opposition.

 

What did Liston do to make anyone here think he could beat Ali?

 

A better comparison would be prime Liston, true. Ali has the stylistic advantage & Liston would likely also be duped by the rope-a-dope.
But as covered extensively on many threads, overwhelming evidence shows that Liston was in all likelihood not born before the early '30's.
He may have been 32 when he first faced Ali, but at most slightly older.
The history of Liston incluing when he lived at home or ran away & most testimony of family + the U.S. census data back this up.

 

This.

1974 Ali was still good enough to beat any version of Liston.

 

Based on what exactly?

 

Swag you have been here a long while, I figured you would have seen some of the threads about Liston's age.
You can look them up here, but his [url]Wikipedia page[/url] outlines some of it & is well sourced.
Attend also to the next section "Youth in Saint Louis". It shows that the timeline to his life, when he was with his birth family, & his own comments about his age do not realistically accommodate anything besides being born in the early 1930's. 1930 or 1932 being most credible.

For one of a few points of reference, if he was not 13 in 1946 as he figured (meaning born no earlier than 1932) but somehow much older, why would he wait until his 20's to leave his deeply abusive Father? A few years later that 13 he could easily have just left-or likely crushed Daddy like a bug.

He just is one of many people that due to whatever combination of genetics & har living looked older than they are.
I have seen people still in or barely out of their teens, & may be pefrectly healthy, who have much older faces that their chronological ages.

 

I was referring to your comment that Liston would've likely fell for the rope-a-dope employed by Ali against Foreman. I see no evidence of this whatsoever.

Regardless, I think '74 Ali beats a '64 Liston but loses to the prime one.

 

OK. Looking at Liston against Ali, I see a fighter who seems like he would continue to strain to land aggressively like Foreman.
Admittedly it is no sure thing.
Would '74 likely lose to a prime Liston? At least in that tiny soft ring I would favor him. More so if Ali was not allowed to get away with the holding & pulling his head down like with Foreman.

In more neutral conditions, this would be a big question!
Prime liston might bwell beat him, despite the stylistic disadvantage, since Ali was still great but off his '60's peak & with much reduced foot speed.

 

Maybe it looks a little like Shavers V Ali?
Liston maybe pacing himself and Ali at times getting caught by Sonny's best shots.
But this being Ali, he hardly shows when he's hurt and Liston looks frustrated.
But some of those shots do hurt and Liston s not going all out crazy.
Ali gets a points win but it's a pretty good showing from The Bear.

 

Ken Norton had managed it not long before to be fair. Who had Kenny beaten to prepare him for such a high level of opposition?

 

Because styles makes fights. Ali's style was all wrong for Liston and Norton's style matched up well with Ali's.