This is the best possible way of putting it. Joshua, at heart, is a road man. So he's gonna put on an act to get that money. Tyson, from everything I've seen of him in and out of the ring, is opportunistic and manipulative. AJ is a fake, Tyson is a liar. Neither is better.
Nobody thinks that Fury is some saintly character. And the other bloke you're replying to never suggested as much. He just said that he's more genuine than Joshua, which he is. Joshua is as plastic and as fake as they come. And on top of that, he doesn't have an ounce of charisma, intelligence or excitement about his personality. He's an utter bore and if you've seen a couple of Joshua interviews, you've seen them all. He's predictable. Most impartial sports fans (I don't know why anybody wouldn't be) want excitement, a bit of entertainment, unpredictability and yes, someone they feel like they can relate to on some sort of level - that's why Fury has benefited from an influx of fans following his lay-off. It wasn't so much the mental health stuff as I think it was Fury "being a lad", drinking, eating crap and taking drugs. There's a lot of things I don't like about Fury and I practically never watch a Fury interview now, but it's not hard to see why a lot of smart people prefer Fury over the plastic Joshua, aside from the aforementioned group who quickly jumped ship. You can dislike Joshua for what he is, inclusive of the fact that his "restricted" personality may be hinged on business, but nobody seems to be suggesting that he may actually come across far worse if it wasn't. There's been times where the mask has slipped and he's come across as extremely unlikeable, and some would say racist. It's not like he would come across as some great, entertaining guy if he were to forego his commercial partnerships. Fury = a hypocritical liar (probably) who is also funny, charismatic, exciting, unpredictable, largely unfiltered (becoming more so as time goes by) and courageous. Joshua = A pawn for the suits. Fake, boring, thick and I'm struggling to find any redeeming qualities. Fury's relationship with the fans is different to that of Joshua's. Joshua is like a Hugh Hefner character who attracts women on the basis of status and money (i.e. glory seekers), whereas Fury attracts his fans on what he really is. Without all of the superficial stuff like looks and marketing, Joshua would be **** all.
I think you've missed a trick here. Joshua has followed the David Beckham playbook. He has taken on an almost saintly persona, almost as if nothing he does can be wrong. It's clever and tactical, and is based on his saying as little as possible so people reflect their best expectations onto him. When he does speak, it's generally bland. There is a certain type of fan who, if you try and criticise Beckham or Joshua will react as if you've just threatened to murder their mother. Shock, incredulity, a basic "you cannot say that about him" response. The irony is that Fury has started to use some of the same tactics since he moved to Top Rank. I thought his lowest ebb was his dressing for Mexican Independence Day for the Otto Wallin fight - it was transparently plastic. His mental health advocacy - a fantastic cause which I am not criticising - has had a commercial angle to it as well. Fortunately for us boxing fans, his natural aggression has taken over during weigh-ins and press conferences and given us what we want. If you ever get the chance, listen to the HBO commentary of Klitschko v Fury, especially after the result is announced. Jim Lampley basically describes Fury as a deeply unusual man, reminds viewers that he accused Klitschko of being a devil worshipper, and tells us what a terrible state the heavyweight scene is in right now. Now compare it to the adulation ESPN give Fury after his marketing makeover and backing from a US promoter. It's all marketing, it's all a product. It's just that Fury has had his very rough edges shaved off, whereas Joshua is having stuff painted on. Two sides of the same coin. (I am a Fury fan, fwiw)
You're right about the donation thing. I think it's unfair to judge regarding mental health unless you've actually walked in his shoes. Better to give people the benefit of the doubt. I think most people fully understand the reason why, especially in a business sense - Tyson has become noticeably more PC since his comeback. It's clear to see why that is.
Well said. Yes exactly, I never suggested Fury is a saint. He's clearly not - he's a flawed person. The charity donation thing that BB mentioned is a very good example of that. He is infinitely more relatable, exciting and interesting than Joshua though as you've detailed really nicely above.
I think both Anthony Joshua and Tyson Fury are decent people. That's the impression I get. Fury's a more interesting character, at his best he is compelling and charismatic ...... but Joshua has a tremendous work ethic and I admire the way he has conducted himself in his defeats and his willingness to go back and test himself again. AJ might be the golden boy but he hasn't taken an easy path. Two decent young men. Both are a credit to this country. I'm surprised by the actual hate they seem to get sometimes.
I've not missed a trick and I've rambled on for long enough on this forum how Fury's ongoing transformation is a hypocritical strategy in the sense that he's partly morphing into what he has always lambasted Joshua for. The point is that he still has qualities Joshua doesn't. There's a spectrum and the scales have been tipping. Whether Fury has more good going for him than bad is a personal judgement by the consumer. For me, it seems that the more revered Fury becomes in the mainstream domain, the more I dislike him, which is pretty much congruent with my general feelings toward celebrity culture and Joshua.
I honestly can't place such weight on OCD that it warrants the lengths that Tyson has took it too. Can you imagine if he had Autism or something serious? Jesus, we'd never hear the end of it.
The main one he's discussed is bi-polar in fairness. Regardless what you think of Fury on a personal level, having a heavyweight champion openly talk about mental health using his platform is a good thing. It's also really significant given his traveller background. I can't really be bothered to go round in circles because I know what you think about Fury and his issues and we're probably not going to agree so I may leave it here.
Fair enough - clumsy wording on my part then and we largely agree. I hope Joshua starts to speak a lot more for himself, even if I will never like him, I will have more respect for someone who is more real. And yes, I 100% agree here. I understand those who question his motives for speaking out - but if a single person has sought help due to hearing him speak, then it has been worth it. It's like someone who donates to charity to reduce their taxes: motives are selfish, but the end result is positive.
Nah I don't think it's just that, he feels more neutered now. Whyte started hitting Joshua back and he almost got himself disqualified for hitting after the bell. It wasn't just Whyte though, there were other times he hit late after the bell and hit guys when they were down. I always thought that nasty streak would really come to the fore when he faced more adversity, but by the time he was filling out stadiums it looked well and truly gone. All about the image by that time.
Tyson Fury is a FIGHTING MAN while Jack it Joshua is NOT - that is the most important difference to boxing fans
Of course you don’t, because you clearly don’t follow the sport. There have been plenty of pros with a lot of losses who have even world titles. Not taking you on any more
Lomachenko vs Orlando Salido (41-12-2) was for the WBO world title and on PPV. Salido won by the way, just in case you didn’t know.
