Gerry Cooney is an all time great

I take pride anyday.

 

Richard, it's hard to respond to your post without mentioning a lot of fighters who ended up as burdens on their families. I'm not going to do that. We all have different experiences in life, but "pride and prestige" don't put food on the table or pay the bills. I like to see a fighter (and it takes good management) make the system work for him/her and walk away from boxing with money and their health. It doesn't happen often.

You might have made an "easy" 20.00 when Holmes beat Cooney, since you weren't getting hit, but I bet Holmes doesn't remember that as an "easy" night. We'll have to disagree about healthy bank accounts meaning nothing...I'll take the healthy bank account and good mental and physical health, with a few fans saying I didn't do enough, over not being able to function, being a burden on my family, and having a few fans saying that I took some impressive beatings in the ring.

 

So is a job, take pride in yourself as well as enjoying your profession. So business is all about letting people take advantage of you and collecting the rewards only to turn into a junkie?

 

I understand what you are saying but let's be honest why the boxing was pushing Gerry Cooney. I will not say it because I do not think it would be appropriate but I gauge a fighter on his skills, his management, work ethics, preparation for a match. Cooney was used, plain and simple. He fought guys that were near going out to pasture, he destroyed them, but I am not impressed. Prestige can go along with a paycheck, but he was not a great fighter. Sure Jerry Quarry ended up the way he did near the end of his life, but he had very prideful moments fighting opponents that were near his age, top contenders. I got my college degree in Psychology, I enjoyed mt profession, helping out others, but money was not the only no.1 priority, an individual should enjoy what he does. Boxing may be different, but Cooney's shady management used him for their gains, If Cooney had been aligned with a really quality trainer, maybe he would have become a better fighter, and would have fought more proven contenders, but also his management showed a lack of confidence in him by matching him with has been's. I knew that Larry was going to beat Cooney, everyone bet on Gerry where I worked. I have seen enough boxing to know otherwise.

 

Gerry Cooney was on the sauce, sorry to insult your favorite fighter, but he did have issues with alcohol. And Gerry lost to all three.

 

You have your opinion, I have mine. He was overhyped in my opinion for one single purpose.

 

To say Victor Valle was not a quality trainer is simply ridiculous.

He trained Cooney, took a very average Billy Costello to a title. He also trained Alfredo Escalera and Esteban DeJesus. I’d say he maximized those guys and probably did the same with many others who fell well short of world championship ability.

You may disagree with the path that his management took and I see what you’re hinting at — there is some truth to it, but Cooney was also a lot like Mike Tyson: a New York guy (media center of the world) who could punch and was very marketable (for different reasons).

We don’t know what we don’t know. I suspect that Gerry’s demons (which someone in the psych field would know have nothing to do with how his managers handled his career — too many alcoholics from all walks of life and all levels of success to suggest that was why he drank) might have had something to do with how they managed him. He pulled out of a lot of fights with mysterious “injuries” which may have been them protecting him from going in the ring after he’d skipped out on training to go on a bender. That’s not cashing him in for selfish profit motive, if this is indeed the case, but protecting him from himself. Again, we don’t know what we don’t know.

But a manager’s job in boxing is to maximize a fighter’s potential AND profit AND get him out of the profession with as little long-lasting damage as possible. I’d say they succeeded on more fronts than not by that measure.

You seem to think that if they didn’t protect him he’d have torn through all opposition and become an invincible ATG … or at least you assess how he was managed that way. Let’s say that’s not the case, that he would have lost three or four and maybe never gotten a title fight. Let’s say he’d have taken a lot of beatings and ended up unable to tie his own shoes like Quarry. I’d say there’s a lot more to criticize in Quarry’s management — throwing him to the wolves with any monster who could generate an instant purse with no regard to his long-term or short-term well-being — than Cooney’s.

The opposite of pride is shame, and I don’t think Gerry Cooney has anything to be ashamed of — he went into the ring well-prepared every time as near as we can tell. He gave his all every time. No quit in him. So he didn’t face murderer’s row … when it’s all said and done he faced Holmes and Spinks and Foreman and he got paid handsomely to do so. What’s not to be proud of?

And why are you criticizing Gerry for facing Jimmy Young? Michael Dokes and Greg Page and many others faced Young (and were unable to stop him, albeit on cuts, but Cooney also did more damage in those four rounds than Young and Page did in their combined entire distance fights). And why not be upset at Tex Cobb for fighting the same Norton who Cooney fought? He was a TOP TEN fighter at that point by every ranking and by every measure, but somehow Gerry (and Gerry alone) should have treated him like he was in a wheelchair gumming his oatmeal? C’mon man.

 

He never beat anyone in the top ten gimmie a break, If Norton was after his Randy Cobb VICTORY may have been no. 10
This successful career was he was in the right time & place to make the money of a 60 plus fite veteran who really fought some names , he's 0-3 against the top, with no real significant victories.

 

you are right my friend .. when people use the argument, well who made more money as the reason he was the " better " boxer argument or whatever, the better decisions means that they are out of ammo .. Here ,, let me prove my point .. Mayweather made the most money in history against an MMA guy with ZERO professional boxing fights ... Thus Mayweather is the the best boxer in the world because people were stupid enough to pay for the fight ,, or were just bored and had nothing better to do
OR let me put it this way .. Thomas Hearns LOST EVERYTHING ... so he is a shitty boxer right ?

 

I don’t see the correlation between having pride and taking senseless beatings. He’s comparing Quarry to Cooney in this sense, and I don’t think Quarry had enough marbles left to have pride when he couldn’t tie his own shoes or didn’t know his own name.

I’m not arguing that Gerry Cooney is an ATG. I don’t know anyone who is. I’m arguing against the thesis that Gerry Cooney has something to be ashamed of, that he should have taken on all comers like Quarry did and I’m arguing that getting out of the most savage profession of all with his senses intact and pocketbook fortified is a good thing.

Would you not rather see Thomas Hearns have gotten out without taking some of the needless beatings that he took later in his career? We see people all the time talk about how sad it is Ali ended up in the state he’s in — where’s the pride in that? Thomas has slurred speech and probably a lot of other issues we don’t know about. That’s not something where we should point and say ‘ah but he was a MAN, he took those beatings and he can be PROUD that he left the ring that way.’

Gerry did alright for himself. I don’t see why we want everyone to end up like Ali like it’s some freaking badge of courage.

 

The bottom line is Cooney was not a mismanaged fighter. As for him not fighting more often or facing better opposition, the only finger to point at in the end is Gerry Cooney himself. Like Marvin Hagler said "It's hard to stay hungry when you're sleeping in satin sheets." Cooney made an enormous payday against Holmes around 10 million dollars in 1982, and was drinking and partying, he simply wasn't motivated, and had drug and alcohol problems. But he wasn't some mafia managed fighter who was taken to the cleaners and left broke and penniless. From a financial aspect Rappaport and Jones were excellent managers, and not only for Cooney, Ronnie Harris, Howard Davis jr, and Billy Costello were all managed by them and paid well also.

 

ya I get that part of it .. But there isnt a perfect blue print when it comes to being a professional athlete in all sports,, some get injured, some dont, some retire early , some keep going till they are dragged off the field or outta the ring at 49.. Some go 4 years and quit because of CTE concerns...Some have something to prove , some are extremely popular and can cherry pick and set their own terms,,, .Everyone cant be a Mayweather and cherry pick and make that much money.... I was referring to who keeps his money and who pisses theirs away which means absolutely nothing when it comes to in the ring performances... thats why I brought up Hearns who lost everything // you know that right ...... As opposed to a Packey McFarland who retired at 25 prime and healthy and easy a mutli millionaire in todays money ( the perfect blue print )
Sure we want all fighters and athletes to make millions , stay healthy, and manage their money well ... and it is a solid point to make as you did and a reminder on how dangerous the sport is
I do agree with you there